280 SE 3.5L Coupe - Worth It?

[carock]

I am looking at a buying a 280 SE 3.5 Liter Coupe. I had a lot of fun building my 1985 300 CD and the results are really good. Now I am thinking about going all the way and buying a 280 SE 3.5L Coupe. Is it really going to be a better ride or does it just have more panache? Any big headaches with this car that are different from a solid W123 diesel?

[fonzi]

Are you talking about a w111 or w112 coupe? It sounds like you would be migrating from a fairly common car to a serious collector.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[subforry]

While both are Mercedes on is a mass produced diesel and other is a hand built luxury car. I think the w111/w112 coups are some of more aesthetically pleasing cars ever. You can expect parts to be about twice the price of the W123, but they are worth it. Keep us posted on your decision.

[Tony H]

Drives just like a 280SE 4.5 but the seating is lower in the car due to the coupe body. Depends on what level of car you are considering. Mechanically pretty simple. Chassis is same as 108 and many others. Engine shares lots with 4.5. Body/glass/bumpers and interior share nothing. If you buy a car with needs it will cost you unless you are satisfied to enjoy it as is. Restored cars are expensive and mostly collectors that don't drive them are at that level.

[carock]

How do you think the V-8 compares to the earlier straight six version?

[morrisone]

Originally Posted by Tony H

Drives just like a 280SE 4.5 but the seating is lower in the car due to the coupe body. Depends on what level of car you are considering. Mechanically pretty simple. Chassis is same as 108 and many others. Engine shares lots with 4.5. Body/glass/bumpers and interior share nothing. If you buy a car with needs it will cost you unless you are satisfied to enjoy it as is. Restored cars are expensive and mostly collectors that don't drive them are at that level.

For a restored ‘69 to ‘71 car that is clean but not necessarily show quality, what is the typical yearly maintenance need if it’s driven at least a couple times a month on average?

[fonzi]

Originally Posted by morrisone

For a restored ‘69 to ‘71 car that is clean but not necessarily show quality, what is the typical yearly maintenance need if it’s driven at least a couple times a month on average?

Impossible to answer.

[morrisone]

Originally Posted by fonzi

Impossible to answer.

A ton of variables, admittedly. I would guess the 3.5 would do well with yearly lube work and oil changes if the car is in similar condition to the one linked below and all the rubber hoses etc. Have been replaced. Having never owned an old MB, what else is missing if the car has under 100,000 miles on it and is in good working condition? Not trying to hijack this thread by the way, but I think this is a complementary inquiry.

https://www.hemmings.com/classifieds/cars-for-sale/mercedes-benz/280se/2458320.html#&gid=1&pid=2

[fonzi]

Originally Posted by morrisone

A ton of variables, admittedly. I would guess the 3.5 would do well with yearly lube work and oil changes if the car is in similar condition to the one linked below and all the rubber hoses etc. Have been replaced. Having never owned an old MB, what else is missing if the car has under 100,000 miles on it and is in good working condition? Not trying to hijack this thread by the way, but I think this is a complementary inquiry.

https://www.hemmings.com/classifieds/cars-for-sale/mercedes-benz/280se/2458320.html#&gid=1&pid=2

While parts might begin to get expensive, it’s mostly labor that you’d be paying for to make sure the car stays in good condition after it’s brought up to good condition.

How hard are you going to be on the car and how much non-wear-and-tear stuff are you going to break.

How anal are you about original equipment vs new equipment. Are you going to change the tires every 5 years? How often are you going to replace all the rubber parts? How often are you going to change the oil? How often are you going to change the coolant? Some people never do this on a car that hardly ever gets driven. Some people have access to stashes of parts and California junk yards where good cars are taken off the road just because California smog registration has lapsed and the California EPA wants all cars off the roads. Other people can’t get a used part without paying over MSRP on eBay for used junk.

I will maintain that if anyone wants a classic car but doesn’t envision themselves collecting the majority of the tools to do all the work themselves, then the car is going to cost you a LOT and you will “lose your ass” on it if considering it an investment. If you enjoy working on cars as a hobby, then it won’t be that bad. W111 coupes, especially 3.5 seem to have really shot up in value recently. So I wouldn’t expect them to be a good investment for the future. Nobody has a crystal ball. But if you enjoy working on cars, I personally think any vintage MB is a great purchase. I personally hate Zenith carbs though and would avoid them, and will probably never buy another MB with dual Zeniths. I like d-Jetronic that’s in the 3.5 and own several 3.5 motor cars I’ve brought back from the dead. The other option for a w111 is mechanical injection which I don’t know. I think d-jet might be better and maybe even easier to get parts for since the 4.5 d-jet parts will work in a pinch, and they are fairly plentiful. I use as many used parts on the junkers that I buy for a few hundred bucks and bring back from the dead. I don’t worry about parking lot door dings and believe I get just as much if not more enjoyment out of the hobby as working on a really nice car, but with less worry.

[berfinroy]

There is a fine W111 3.5 coupe on BaT now that is already up to $125,000 with 2 days to go. It will, of course, go higher in the end. On the other hand, the best 280SEL 3.5 or 4.5 would probably go for 20% of the anticipated final price on this car, drives just as well and caries 4 people in splendid comfort (the back seat of the coupe and convertible 3.5s is very cramped).
The coupes and especially the convertible are the more certain investments, but you need to tie up a lot more money to get on board.

[Tony H]

The Ca JY's have pretty much dried up in the last 10 years or so.
It used to be there was always several 108's in the Pick n Pulls now nothing.
I remember pulling a 3.27 axle from a 4.5 over my lunch time once.

Originally Posted by fonzi

While parts might begin to get expensive, it’s mostly labor that you’d be paying for to make sure the car stays in good condition after it’s brought up to good condition.

How hard are you going to be on the car and how much non-wear-and-tear stuff are you going to break.

How anal are you about original equipment vs new equipment. Are you going to change the tires every 5 years? How often are you going to replace all the rubber parts? How often are you going to change the oil? How often are you going to change the coolant? Some people never do this on a car that hardly ever gets driven. Some people have access to stashes of parts and California junk yards where good cars are taken off the road just because California smog registration has lapsed and the California EPA wants all cars off the roads. Other people can’t get a used part without paying over MSRP on eBay for used junk.

I will maintain that if anyone wants a classic car but doesn’t envision themselves collecting the majority of the tools to do all the work themselves, then the car is going to cost you a LOT and you will “lose your ass” on it if considering it an investment. If you enjoy working on cars as a hobby, then it won’t be that bad. W111 coupes, especially 3.5 seem to have really shot up in value recently. So I wouldn’t expect them to be a good investment for the future. Nobody has a crystal ball. But if you enjoy working on cars, I personally think any vintage MB is a great purchase. I personally hate Zenith carbs though and would avoid them, and will probably never buy another MB with dual Zeniths. I like d-Jetronic that’s in the 3.5 and own several 3.5 motor cars I’ve brought back from the dead. The other option for a w111 is mechanical injection which I don’t know. I think d-jet might be better and maybe even easier to get parts for since the 4.5 d-jet parts will work in a pinch, and they are fairly plentiful. I use as many used parts on the junkers that I buy for a few hundred bucks and bring back from the dead. I don’t worry about parking lot door dings and believe I get just as much if not more enjoyment out of the hobby as working on a really nice car, but with less worry.

[morrisone]

Originally Posted by fonzi

While parts might begin to get expensive, it’s mostly labor that you’d be paying for to make sure the car stays in good condition after it’s brought up to good condition.

How hard are you going to be on the car and how much non-wear-and-tear stuff are you going to break.

How anal are you about original equipment vs new equipment. Are you going to change the tires every 5 years? How often are you going to replace all the rubber parts? How often are you going to change the oil? How often are you going to change the coolant? Some people never do this on a car that hardly ever gets driven. Some people have access to stashes of parts and California junk yards where good cars are taken off the road just because California smog registration has lapsed and the California EPA wants all cars off the roads. Other people can’t get a used part without paying over MSRP on eBay for used junk.

I will maintain that if anyone wants a classic car but doesn’t envision themselves collecting the majority of the tools to do all the work themselves, then the car is going to cost you a LOT and you will “lose your ass” on it if considering it an investment. If you enjoy working on cars as a hobby, then it won’t be that bad. W111 coupes, especially 3.5 seem to have really shot up in value recently. So I wouldn’t expect them to be a good investment for the future. Nobody has a crystal ball. But if you enjoy working on cars, I personally think any vintage MB is a great purchase. I personally hate Zenith carbs though and would avoid them, and will probably never buy another MB with dual Zeniths. I like d-Jetronic that’s in the 3.5 and own several 3.5 motor cars I’ve brought back from the dead. The other option for a w111 is mechanical injection which I don’t know. I think d-jet might be better and maybe even easier to get parts for since the 4.5 d-jet parts will work in a pinch, and they are fairly plentiful. I use as many used parts on the junkers that I buy for a few hundred bucks and bring back from the dead. I don’t worry about parking lot door dings and believe I get just as much if not more enjoyment out of the hobby as working on a really nice car, but with less worry.

Great information. Thank you, fonzi! My ultimate intent if I make the move would be to buy one that has already had all the major mechanical and cosmetic work completed. It doesn’t need to be perfect or show quality, but as close as reasonable. It would only get driven gently a few times a month and annual mileage would be under 1,000 I’m guessing. My focus would be on maintaining it in a way that preserves the mechanical and physical condition I bought it in. It’s just a glimmer in my eye at this point which is why I’m trying to get my knowledge of the basics up to snuff. I’ve been known to make impulse buys from time to time, and these cars definitely evoke emotion!

[Tomguy]

Originally Posted by berfinroy

On the other hand, the best 280SEL 3.5 or 4.5 would probably go for 20% of the anticipated final price on this car, drives just as well and caries 4 people in splendid comfort (the back seat of the coupe and convertible 3.5s is very cramped).
The coupes and especially the convertible are the more certain investments, but you need to tie up a lot more money to get on board.

I never understood that. I never will. True car fans, IMO, can appreciate a vehicle regardless of doors. The convertible has a different purpose from the coupe or sedan - you can put the top down, and that has a huge tax to go along with it. But a 108 sedan vs a 111 coupe is just as beautiful, will catch just as many eyes on the road, rides the same (maybe better with LWB), handles the same (these cars aren't handlers, they're cruisers) and costs *SLIGHTLY* less to maintain without 111-specific tail lenses, bumpers, etc. The 4.5 feels essentially the same as the 3.5 (quicker if you put in the 3.5 rear end), it's the same engine with a longer stroke.

This is also what I am getting from a lot of other people my age. The "2 doors better" seems to be a prior-generation thing. Car fans around 40 or younger don't care about doors, which means now would be the time to buy a sedan, because they are getting harder to find and will appreciate in value. 10 years ago 108s were not worth restoring, because you'd be lucky to get $8-10k out of them if you put $6-10k into them. Now, forget it. 10 years ago, 6.3s in great shape were $15-25k (and $25k were superb vehicles). I strongly suspect that explosion in value will keep going.

[Tony H]

A 111 coupe is not a 2 door version of a 108 and was never intended to be-it's a totally different car (different proportions, interior etc) that was intended to appeal to different buyers. I think the tide is lifting most vintage MB's. I have been watching R107's for a while and they are coming into their own. Some Marques are very sensitive to the market but I think vintage MB's have more substance and purpose than a Ferrari or Porsche that's bought as an investment.

[carock]

Well, the car I was willing to bid on at BAT just sold for $195k. I bet there has been $250k spent on that car. I was prepared for a little over $100k, but too rich for me. A 280 SE V-8 Coupe may be out of my reach if I am looking for a rust free car.