removing thermostat in Pinto motor in my Formula ford - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

t walgamuth · #1 08-11-2012, 10:07 AM

I have been advised by the local Formula ford expert that my car will run cooler if I remove the thermostat. He believes it is a restriction to maximum flow.

The car has two radiators and no fan. It was originally designed for road course work. With our short autocross courses there is not that much air flow through the radiators and there is no cooling fan.

The car runs reasonably cool but will overheat in the paddock between runs if idled too long.

I am skeptical that the stat is actually restricting flow. Any Engineers out there with some good info on this point?

The engine is the Ford Kent 1.6 liter motor. Pushrod english ford engine found in this country in a Pinto about 1971 or so.

Brian Carlton · #2 08-11-2012, 11:02 AM

If you take a look at the area of the stat where the coolant can flow, you'll see that it's a fraction of the area of the upper hose to the radiator. Therefore, it can certainly be considered a restriction to flow.

However, the flow rate is not the sole determining factor as to the capability to cool. The capacity of the radiator to dump BTU's is an important variable. Adding more flow without the benefit of a large radiator might not provide any benefits.

The typical cooling fan doesn't do much at low engine speeds and, without any vehicle speed, the engine might overheat anyway with the additional flow.

There is only one way to know..............

t walgamuth · #3 08-11-2012, 12:37 PM

....pull it out.

And that is what my favoriet machinist said too. Try it.

Stretch · #4 08-11-2012, 01:20 PM

And if that doesn't work a portable (mains) electric fan to put in front of the car whilst it is in the paddock!

Pooka · #5 08-11-2012, 03:16 PM

Back about 50 years ago it was common practice to pull out your thermostat during the summer months. It was easy to do and it saved wear and tear on your stat. It also eliminated the fear that your stat would fail during the summer and leave you stranded.

You put it back in during the winter to help your engine warm up. Engines then ran poorly when cold, so a quick warm up was a good thing.

Mercedes took a different approach and that was to put in a small stat bypass so if your thermostat failed you would still have coolant flow. You would run hotter, but you would not be boiling over.

So I would say take it out. As I recall this is a very easy job on this engine.

kerry · #6 08-11-2012, 03:57 PM

Just turn off the AC and turn on the heater when you're in the pits.

t walgamuth · #7 08-11-2012, 06:56 PM

Benz Fan · #8 08-11-2012, 08:18 PM

It seems unproductive to retain a thermostat in your cooling system. You can control the time you start the engine relative to the time you begin to drive, so you can ensure that the engine and oil are properly warmed up before you stress the engine, and you certainly don't need a fast warmup for interior heat and windshield defrosting.

layback40 · #9 08-11-2012, 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Army

And if that doesn't work a portable (mains) electric fan to put in front of the car whilst it is in the paddock!

X2

Thats what the F1 teams do.
A fan(s) blowing into the air duct(s) to the radiator(s).

t walgamuth · #10 08-11-2012, 10:21 PM

I have considered the auxiliary fan idea.

Today I looked again at the timing and I think It was overly retarded. I bumped it forward and I imagine that will help with the heat. I also removed the stat.

Off to the races bright and early.

Stretch · #11 08-12-2012, 02:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by layback40

X2

Thats what the F1 teams do.
A fan(s) blowing into the air duct(s) to the radiator(s).

And rolling roads too - though I think they are more of the heavy duty 3 phase motor types...

cmbdiesel · #12 08-12-2012, 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian Carlton

If you take a look at the area of the stat where the coolant can flow, you'll see that it's a fraction of the area of the upper hose to the radiator. Therefore, it can certainly be considered a restriction to flow.

However, the flow rate is not the sole determining factor as to the capability to cool. The capacity of the radiator to dump BTU's is an important variable. Adding more flow without the benefit of a large radiator might not provide any benefits.

The typical cooling fan doesn't do much at low engine speeds and, without any vehicle speed, the engine might overheat anyway with the additional flow.

There is only one way to know..............

Isn't it possible to gain too much flow? Where the coolant does not stay in the radiator long enough to cool sufficiently?

OMEGAMAN · #13 08-12-2012, 09:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmbdiesel

Isn't it possible to gain too much flow? Where the coolant does not stay in the radiator long enough to cool sufficiently?

Yep! Experienced that myself on a small block chev.

engatwork · #14 08-12-2012, 09:59 PM

During troubleshooting BMW's with the electric water pump it is interesting to watch the engine temp and radiator outlet temp while cruising at 80 mph on the interstate. Based on what I can tell it seems that you are only using 30 to 40% of the radiators cooling capacity during those conditions.

Hatterasguy · #15 08-12-2012, 10:02 PM

Just pull the T stat it sounds like that engine can't shed to much heat.

Oh and don't idle in the paddock.

When I'm at the race track they don't idle any of the old cars unless they are working on them. Start and go. The old cars from the 30's don't have any cooling fans either.