safety of third row seats? - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

t walgamuth · #1 02-25-2009, 07:21 PM

My lovely #1 daughter who has three little ones form age 2 to 7 just bought an 01 benz wagon....an e class with the third seat.

What is the story of safety of kids riding back there?

Is it in a crumple zone or what?

DieselAddict · #2 02-25-2009, 07:37 PM

I was wondering the same thing and while the 3rd row probably isn't terribly dangerous, I'm sure the 2nd row is safer.

MTI · #3 02-25-2009, 08:11 PM

Since you can't account for all accidents, particularly the speed and mass of the vehicle that rear ends it . . . keeping kids (actually any living thing) away from the front or rear would seem to be the best decision.

Medmech · #4 02-25-2009, 08:22 PM

I have a link for them somewhere regarding MB and Volvo 3rd row seats, IIRC they are safe, depending on the crash. Personally I can't fathom an Excursion coming into the rear passenger compartment of our wagon so I prefer the kids to be in their own respective seats in the designed passenger cabin...thats why wifey and the kids only travel in MB or Volvo. I'd rather be in the 3rd row of a MB or Volvo opposed to the normal seating of almost anyhing else.
http://au.geocities.com/ozbrick850/crash-rear.html
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9A04E6D9103BF930A15752C1A9659C8B63&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=1

Pete Geither · #5 02-25-2009, 08:39 PM

As much as I love my wagons, I will never let the grandkids sit in the 3rd seat. Crumple zones only come into play when the lower structure of the vehicle is hit. If a higher vehicle slams into the back of the wagon, they could rip right up to the second seat with ease. I've had nightmares about the possibilities.

t walgamuth · #6 02-25-2009, 09:18 PM

Excelent point! A taller vehicle seems a good possibility too.

Medmech · #7 02-25-2009, 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete Geither

As much as I love my wagons, I will never let the grandkids sit in the 3rd seat. Crumple zones only come into play when the lower structure of the vehicle is hit. If a higher vehicle slams into the back of the wagon, they could rip right up to the second seat with ease. I've had nightmares about the possibilities.

I worry the most about forward whiplash of a child in a rear seat it doesn't take much to tear the carotid tissue of a child, aside from a bumper to the head the forward motion alone can tear their head off. If they do ride in the rear seat they should wear helmets with neck harness's.

Medmech · #8 02-26-2009, 07:14 AM

Safety Comparison of Vehicles with 3rd Row Seats

The trend for families is to buy vehicles than can seat more than 5 passengers. Most of these vehicles have three rows of seating, but not all of them are equal in terms of safety. Many larger vehicles lack important crash test results and some have a relatively high risk of rollover. Not many vehicles with three rows of seating have side curtain airbags for all rows; even fewer deploy them when a rollover is detected. An equally important new safety feature is stability control, which is proving to help drivers avoid crashes in these larger vehicles that often have inferior handling compared to passenger cars. Don't assume the largest, heaviest vehicles are safest. According to IIHS death statistics, once a vehicle is over 4000 pounds, additional weight does not significantly reduce the risk of fatalities in a multi-vehicle crash. Most large sport utility vehicles do not get top ratings in the NHTSA and IIHS frontal crash tests and many others have no crash test results.

Rear impacts can be dangerous to third row passengers. Fortunately, severe rear-end impacts are relatively uncommon. Only around 5% to 7% of fatalities occur in rear-enders. The main risk is to heavy adults who might cause the vehicle seat back to fail in a serious crash. This risk is even greater if the adults don't have head restraints and shoulder belts. If you will regularly carry adults in a third row, insist on features like head restraints and 3-point lap/shoulder seatbelts in ALL rear seating positions. Lap-only belts are not safe for adults or children in boosters, in any type of crash. On the other hand, kids in harnessed child seats or high back boosters are at much less risk in a third row. They are much lighter, and less likely to load the vehicle seat back mechanism to failure. The shell of their restraints should also provide some protection from intrusion as well as adequate head restraint to prevent whiplash injuries. Even safer, a child restraint with a 5-point harness can reduce the risk of ejection. For a child using an appropriate restraint, the center of the third row is usually a safer choice than an outside seat in the second row. Some vehicles lack shoulder belts in the rear center position, so a child using a booster could not be seated there. In these cases, if permitted by the vehicle owner's manual, a child restraint with a 5-point harness can usually be installed with just a lap belt, though a top-tether is always recommended for additional safety. Finally, vehicles with well over a foot of space between the 3rd row seat and rear hatch may have an advantage over those with just a few inches separating passengers from the rear of the vehicle.

Please research carefully if safety is a main concern in your choice of a vehicle for your family. According to the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA), motor vehicle crashes remain the leading cause of death for people aged 4 to 33 years, exceeding most other causes combined. Each year in the United States, more than 1.5 million children under age 16 are occupants in motor vehicle crashes, resulting in more than 1,700 fatalities and 240,000 non-fatal injuries. Please, protect your family with a safe vehicle, be sure to properly restrain all passengers and always drive unimpaired with your full attention on the road. These few easy choices significantly reduce the chance of death or serious injury on the roads.

The requirements for safe vehicles with three rows of seating are very tough, but also very straightforward.

1) Must be an IIHS TOP SAFETY PICK. This ensures GOOD ratings in all the IIHS results as well as electronic stability control. Some vehicles only offer stability control as an option, so consumers must be sure to include this option or a trim package with this option. Consider models that also tout a rollover safety package that integrates the stability control and airbag system when a rollover is detected.

2) Must have 5-stars in all the NHTSA crash test ratings

3) Must have at least 4-stars in the NHTSA rollover rating

4) Must have side curtain airbags for ALL rows of seating, including the third row. Consider models that tout individual side impact sensors for all three rows of seating.

5) Head restraints and 3-point seatbelts for all seating positions.

Only a very few models will meet these criteria, so please shop carefully!

Also:

http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/c...-205/index.htm

http://www.edmunds.com/ownership/saf...4/article.html
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jlomon · #9 02-26-2009, 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Howitzer

I worry the most about forward whiplash of a child in a rear seat it doesn't take much to tear the carotid tissue of a child, aside from a bumper to the head the forward motion alone can tear their head off. If they do ride in the rear seat they should wear helmets with neck harness's.

This is exactly why I wont let children ride in the rear-facing seat of our wagon - it is too great a worry. If the vehicle is rear-ended the energy transfer is towards the font of the car, which has the neck of a rear-facing child snapping backwards without anything to stop it properly. The seatbelt doesn't do as much good in that situation, either, because it is designed with arresting forward motion in mind, but a rear-facing child would actually be moving backwards, relative to the crash.

jlomon · #10 02-26-2009, 08:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by t walgamuth

My lovely #1 daughter who has three little ones form age 2 to 7 just bought an 01 benz wagon....an e class with the third seat.

What is the story of safety of kids riding back there?

Is it in a crumple zone or what?

One thing to definitely keep in mind here Tom is what the manufacturer of your child safety seats say. My seats explicity forbid being placed in a rear-facing 3rd row seat. Check the instruction manual on each seat/booster she will be using.

MTUpower · #11 02-26-2009, 08:31 AM

My kids sit in the third row from time to time, and yes I worry about being rear ended. I don't worry that much however- I'm just not the worrying type. I installed a third brake light on both wagons, and with that I move on to other things to worry about. I let the wife worry- it's pretty much all mother's job to worry and I don't like the duplication of work in my house.

PaulC · #12 02-26-2009, 11:01 AM

Back in the Seventies, a video had been produced showing the results of a rear-end collision of a large American station wagon with a rearward facing third-row seat. The unbelted child-sized crash dummies went through the tailgate window and landed on the hood of the striking vehicle. Not good. Any occupants of those seats better have the discipline to keep their seat belts ON.

Lexxani · #13 02-26-2009, 12:03 PM

the thrid row in the back of my 3/4 ton suburban is perfectly safe, unless of course a semi meets my bumper.

SwampYankee · #14 02-26-2009, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTUpower

My kids sit in the third row from time to time, and yes I worry about being rear ended. I don't worry that much however- I'm just not the worrying type. I installed a third brake light on both wagons, and with that I move on to other things to worry about. I let the wife worry- it's pretty much all mother's job to worry and I don't like the duplication of work in my house.

I'm the same way, including what would happen if I got T-boned at 50 mph in an intersection or if a car crosses the median and hits us head-on at highway speeds. The worry is there but I don't dwell on it. Snowmobiling, motocross, kart racing, crazy bicycle freestyle stuff, skiing, snowboarding all have the potential to do them great harm or worse. My wife worries about all that stuff. I show them how to do it safely, get them to stay within their abilities and wear whatever safety gear required. There's always the chance that "the other guy" is going to hit and hurt you no matter what you do. I'm embarassed to say I'm a lot more alert of what's going on around me when I have kids in the car than when I'm by myself. I should be that cautious all the time.

Skid Row Joe · #15 02-26-2009, 02:02 PM

Third row is absolutely more at risk than second row in a rear end collision. If you have the conviction to have that many kids, that's a judgement call. A family of eight needs the third row. New Chrysler mini-vans can only seat 7 strapped in. The older Chrysler minis could accomodate 8.