I posted this on the Pentagon thread, but it got buried in the personal attacks.
In the link, there are two videos, one of the Tower collapse and the other of building 7. I'm interested in people's thoughts on the appearances of explosions in the videos.

http://www.libertyforum.org/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=consp_911&Number=293140235

__________________
1977 300d 70k--sold 08
1985 300TD 185k+
1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03
1985 409d 65k--sold 06
1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car
1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11
1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper
1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4
1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13

I'm not claiming to be an expert, and I haven't checked the credentials of the person giving the opinion at the site, but could the "squibs" as he calls them be rationally explained by other sources, including the pressure of dust and debris being forced out by the heat and pressure generated by the impact and subsequent fires?

Exactly what I would like to know. However, I don't see how such an explanation would work for Bldg 7 since it was not hit by anything. Boneheaddoctor suggested in the other thread that debris hit bldg 7 but there is a picture at the site after the two towers had collapsed but before 7 collapsed. Other buildings suffered damaged from debris from the towers, but no evidence of damage to 7 before it came down.

I read a summary of the engineering report on bldg 7. I believe they were considering the standard hypothesis for the collapse of 7, which is that fires inside caused it. They go with that hypothesis but state that it has a very low probablity that it would happen that way.

Here's a link with more info:

http://st12.startlogic.com/~xenonpup/collapse%20update/index.htm


Here's an hypothesis I haven't run across: After the 1993 attack on WTC, someone (?) considered that another attack was possible and thought it might result in huge demolition problems with possible loss of life if the buildings were only partially collapsed in the attack so pre-charged the buildings with demolitions devices to bring them down safetly. And even considered that using the devices in the case of an attack would actually save lives because it would bring the buildings straight down rather than falling sideways and destroying many other buildings and killing lots of people adjacent to the buildings. So, it was an accidental or deliberate use of this charges that brought down the towers and deliberate use of the charges to bring down bldg 7. This would account for why the owner of the buildings stated 'Let's pull the bldg."

I can even imagine an insurance company requiring such advance planning as a pre-condition for continued insurance after the first attack.

__________________
1977 300d 70k--sold 08
1985 300TD 185k+
1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03
1985 409d 65k--sold 06
1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car
1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11
1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper
1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4
1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13

. . . Mulder . . .err, Kerry . . . the truth is out there . . .

The more I think about it,the more I am tempted by my hypothesis. After the first WTC bombing, with so much money at risk, the insurance companies would surely have put actuaries and risk analysts at work to protect themselves in the event of future attacks. It seems quite possible to me that someone could predict that the safest course of action which would limit damages in the case of a future attack which caused serious structural damage to the buildings, would be a contolled demolition. I can easily see where a controlled demolition would actually save lives and property and limit the economic consequences of an attack.

__________________
1977 300d 70k--sold 08
1985 300TD 185k+
1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03
1985 409d 65k--sold 06
1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car
1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11
1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper
1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4
1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13

Can you say that with a straight face to the almost 3000
people that lost their life that day.


I could understand this if the towers had been completely evacuated
but not with that many people left in the buildings.
If this is true then many will see this as murder, including me.

Louis.

Kerry have you seen the WTC documentary on discovery or history?

It starts with the architecture from the footings to the tippy top and dissects exactly why, how and when each building collapsed. I recall they provided the calculations including velocity of the fall and the heat generated by the friction of the fall right down to the ricktor scale reading from various distances.

Regarding why the building fell straight down, they were designed that way.

Is that a Europeon laden 757 or African? stop guessing.

Here's the reply I got from Griffin when I e-mailed him my hypothesis:

Dear Kerry,

Nice to hear from you.

I assume that Building 7 (as well as the Towers) was indeed brought down by controlled demolition, which meant that it had to have been wired long in advance and then the explosives placed not long before 9/11. But whether this was under orders from the insurance company, Giuliani, Silverstein, the FBI, and/or the Port Authority I would not speculate. But I certainly hope that someday there is a real investigation, because I would certainly like to know.

I don’t know if you’ve seen the Afterword to the Updated Edition of NPH, in which I discuss the WTC at greater length.

Also somewhat in my new book (propaganda below). I’ll hope for another great review from you.

Cordially,
DG


THE 9/11 COMMISSION REPORT: OMISSIONS AND DISTORTIONS

(A Critique of the Kean-Zelikow Report)

David Ray Griffin






“With this new book, David Ray Griffin establishes himself, alongside Seymour Hersh, as America’s number one bearer of unpleasant, yet necessary, public truths.”--Richard Falk, Professor of International Law, Emeritus, Princeton University



Griffin shows that the final report of the 9/11 Commission, far from being the definitive account of 9/11 it was supposed to be, is riddled with omissions and distortions. Rather than genuinely asking how the attacks were able to succeed, the Commission merely defended the account provided by the Bush administration and its Pentagon. Any evidence that challenged this account--by suggesting instead that the attacks were enabled by the Bush administration itself--was either distorted or simply omitted.



“In this masterful sequel to The New Pearl Harbor, David Ray Griffin unveils a disparity between official 9/11 "spin" and independently researched 9/11 fact so glaring as to suggest the possibility of a constitutional crisis unlike anything our country has ever known. . . . [This book] seriously--and alarmingly--challenges the independence, impartiality, and thoroughness of the 9/11 Commission."--Burns H. Weston, Professor of Law Emeritus, University of Iowa



"David is a national treasure. His first book was great. This book . . . is even better.”--Meria Heller (www.Meria.net)

----------------------



THE 9/11 COMMISSION REPORT:

OMISSIONS AND DISTORTIONS

David Ray Griffin


Acknowledgments

INTRODUCTION

PART ONE THE COMMISSION’S OMISSIONS AND DISTORTIONS

1. The Alleged Hijackers

2. The Collapse of the World Trade Center Buildings

3. The Strike on the Pentagon

4. The Behavior of Bush and His Secret Service

5. Advance Information about the Attacks

6. Osama, the bin Ladens, and the Saudi Royal Family

7. The Saudi Flights

8. FBI Obstructions

9. Pakistan and Its ISI

10. Possible Motives of the Bush Administration



PART TWO THE COMMISSION’S DEFENSE OF THE US MILITARY

11. Problems in Earlier Accounts of the Flights

12. The Commission on Flight 11

13. The Commission on Flight 175

14. The Commission on Flight 77

15. The Commission on Flight 93

16. The FAA: Taking the Fall

CONCLUSION

APPENDIX

Notes

Index of Names

--------------------------



“This is a painstaking and devastating demolition of the lies transmitted by The 9/11 Commission Report . . . . Griffin’s book will strengthen the cause of those who believe that the best defense for democracy is not blind fealty to leaders, but the truth.”--Peter Dale Scott, author of Drugs, Oil, and War



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“This careful deconstruction of what many have called “The 9/11 Omission Commission” skewers, with academic rigor, both the official 9/11 story and its associated cover-up. David Ray Griffin's is one of the finest minds at work in the pursuit of truth about 9/11.”--Barrie Zwicker, Canadian Media Critic and Commentator



“It is rather obvious that the 9/11 commission aimed more to bring closure than to investigate the anomalies surrounding the event. . . . For those who still seek the truth and hope for a serious investigation of the facts, Griffin's careful analysis of the report is essential reading.”--John B. Cobb, Jr., Professor of Theology, Emeritus, Claremont School of Theology

--------------------------



The 9/11 Commission Report: Omissions and Distortions

A Critique of the Kean-Zelikow Report

By David Ray Griffin

Olive Branch Press of Interlink Books

www.interlinkbooks.com/Books_/911CommRep.html

ISBN 1-56656-584-7 ppbk. 352 pages $18.00



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---------------

Feel free to forward this message to your friends and colleagues.

__________________
1977 300d 70k--sold 08
1985 300TD 185k+
1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03
1985 409d 65k--sold 06
1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car
1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11
1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper
1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4
1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13

I foresee and world wide Reynolds wrap shortage.

I saw a PBS show a long time ago. Griffin analyzes the speed of the fall and claims it is at freefall. He states this is not possible without explosive help because it indicates that no floor provided any resistance to the falling floors above. This is counterintuitive to the laws of physics.
Bldg 7 is a particular problem. No structural damage by impact anywhere, yet when it falls, there is a kink in the bldg from top to bottom just like in controlled demolition. As I noted above, the forensic report on its collapse indicated that there was a very low probability that the relatively small fires inside caused enough structural weaknesses for the whole building to fail.

__________________
1977 300d 70k--sold 08
1985 300TD 185k+
1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03
1985 409d 65k--sold 06
1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car
1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11
1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper
1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4
1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13

The show on Discovery showed exactly why and how the floors fell. I'm not going to elaborte more I think you need to give this guy $29.99 for his book.

http://dsc.discovery.com/convergence/eti/ask/klemencic.html

This guys not selling a book.

Here are some pictures of steel/concrete buildings that fell down. None of them turned to dust:

http://geoinfo.usc.edu/gees/RecentEQ/Taiwan/Report/Aerial_Survey/Image146.jpg
http://geoinfo.usc.edu/gees/RecentEQ/Taiwan/Report/Aerial_Survey/Image145.jpg
http://geoinfo.usc.edu/gees/RecentEQ/Taiwan/Report/Aerial_Survey/Image163.jpg
http://geoinfo.usc.edu/gees/RecentEQ/Taiwan/Report/Aerial_Survey/Image169.jpg
http://geoinfo.usc.edu/gees/RecentEQ/Taiwan/Report/Aerial_Survey/Image181.jpg
http://geoinfo.usc.edu/gees/RecentEQ/Taiwan/Report/Aerial_Survey/Image182.jpg

__________________
1977 300d 70k--sold 08
1985 300TD 185k+
1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03
1985 409d 65k--sold 06
1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car
1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11
1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper
1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4
1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13

None had an airliner fly in them either.

As to the pictures, the places seem to be in Japan, who
we all know have problems with earthquackes.
Comparing earthquacke damage with airliner damage is
like compairing pears and apples.

Louis.

Sir, have you ever been to the site of a controlled explosive demolition of a multi-story building? I have personally been to two here in Hawaii, the Biltmore Hotel in Waikiki and the Kaiser Foundation Hospital, also in Waikiki. Neither of those building had anywhere near the mass or area that the WTC had, however when a six story steel and concrete building gets dropped on itself, there's plenty of debris that ranges from structural steel to dust.