Non MB trans to MB engines - Page 47 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

OM616 · #**691** 01-30-2020, 06:01 PM

I modified the MB flywheel bolts so I could bolt up the adapter to the crank. The picture is of the new flywheel and pressure plate all bolted up to the crank.

Today I also made a mock up pilot bearing that has a slip fit into the crank. Up to this point, I have been using a gauge pilot bearing tool I made some time ago.

After bolting everything up, I am happy to say that the yoke is where it should be, but I do what to move the ring gear / trigger ring back about .075" to center up the trigger windows to the center of the sensor. To do that I will add .075 to the adapter drawing and make a new one. I can use this one when I mock up the SBC bell housing.

At this point I am ready to pull the trigger to order the adapter plate billet and have the adapter water jetted out and machine the bolt and pin holes it it. I have the bushing material for the pilot busing so I can also make a real pilot busing that presses into the crank. I will also order a clutch slave cylinder so I can have everything bolted up as it would be in a car.

The starter is the only decision that needs to be made in order to either open up the 420G bell housing starter bolts, or make a spacer for the BMW starter.

The M117/119 to 420G kit development is very close to being concluded.

3doghouse · #**692** 02-02-2020, 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rwd4evr

That's awesome. So how did you do it accurately? Just drilled through the plate into the block and reamed it? Then knocked a dowel pin in?

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Once located, we kept it registered by pinning it through the bellhousing flange into the adapter plate. You could dowel the plate to the block, then the bellhousing to the plate, but we didn't do it that way.

Not that I'd recommend it, but you could skip pinning all together, and just re-indicate it each time the bellhousing is removed. Tedious, but that way there would be no doubt, and how often do you really need to remove the bellhousing anyway?

OM616 · #**693** 02-04-2020, 07:03 PM

Made some studs with M12 on one end and M10 on the other to bolt the MB starter nose cone up to the BMW trans.

They are made from 17-4 Stainless and I made the M12 thread 1.70 instead of 1.75 which makes an interference thread when it is screwed in all the way.

rwd4evr · #**694** 02-07-2020, 12:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3doghouse

Once located, we kept it registered by pinning it through the bellhousing flange into the adapter plate. You could dowel the plate to the block, then the bellhousing to the plate, but we didn't do it that way.

Not that I'd recommend it, but you could skip pinning all together, and just re-indicate it each time the bellhousing is removed. Tedious, but that way there would be no doubt, and how often do you really need to remove the bellhousing anyway?

So the plate isn't registered on the block? If it's not then you will be removing the bellhousing plenty. I just can't trust that pressure from the parts bolted together keeps them absolutely still under clutch dumps, missed downshifts and if it wiggles it's self loose at all it's going to go very badly. I'm hoping I'm wrong but I know of at least two people that claim to have done the midplate onto an alloy block and you don't hear anything about them still running or at least driving. I'm sure I could hog it all out and get them together in a couple days but I don't like the way they get together with minimal bolts lining up in the block. Yours is a(slightly) different case with a plate bolted to the block and the Ford bell to the plate ( I think that's what you said right?) . Every adapter I've seen sold by a company hasocating dowels to both parts. Ideally offset to adjust things.

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cth350 · #**695** 02-07-2020, 09:47 AM

No ford bellhosuing here, for this conversion at least. -cth

OM616 · #**696** 02-07-2020, 12:53 PM

There are a couple of separate conversations going on as of late and I want to be sure that there is not any confusion as to what CTH and I are doing (and I think CTH is planning on selling).

The adapter plate for the alloy M117/119 engines use the MB dowel pins to locate the adapter to the respective blocks and the Bell housing dowel pins to locate the bell housing to the adapter plate.

The adapter plate, flywheel, and clutch kit, we are finishing up right now is to mate a Getrag 420G 6-speed manual trans to the Alloy M117/119 blocks.

Once the 420G kit is done, I think the next best option is a Small Block Chevy bell housing and flywheel kit, (the Ford Bell housing has too many bolt conflicts with the M117/119 blocks to be a viable option).

Just like the 420G, the SBC block adapter and flywheel will allow a SBC bell housing and compatible trans to be bolted up to the Alloy M117/119 blocks as if it were a SBC block.

Again, all configurations will use the respective OEM dowel pins to locate components to each other.

cth350 · #**697** 02-07-2020, 01:01 PM

Cth isnt selling, just building with a good deal of help from Dave. Should anybody want more IP than what Dave and I has shared, then there's a separate, private
discussion to have.

To date, nobody's asked about replicating this solution. So I'm worried one way or the other.

Right now, I am preoccupied with getting the car that this is going into back in my garage in NY and being ready to run.

-cth

Roncallo · #**698** 02-08-2020, 10:40 AM

Now that I'm retired I can officially join in on the fun. For me it will be a M120 V12 setup. CHT has very kindly provided me with a cutup M120 block and crank to do some evaluations.

It will be a while before I can get started as I am knee deep in fitting Samson with AC. See the thread under Long term projects and restorations. " Finishing Samson"

cth350 · #**699** 02-08-2020, 10:56 AM

John stopped by for a visit. I had stumbled across a very dead v12 for parts last year and considered a great opportunity to pick up a large, exotic paperweight. And an opportunity to work with somebody to do a different setup.

I look forward to John's journey. -cth

Roncallo · #**700** 02-08-2020, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cth350

John stopped by for a visit. I had stumbled across a very dead v12 for parts last year and considered a great opportunity to pick up a large, exotic paperweight. And an opportunity to work with somebody to do a different setup.

I look forward to John's journey. -cth

I forgot the flywheel, do you have it?

cth350 · #**701** 02-08-2020, 11:04 PM

It's around here some place. I have an m100 right where I am standing. The M120 cant be far off. -cth

rwd4evr · #**702** 02-09-2020, 03:00 AM

Yes, I was referring to the done t5/560slc swap with regards to the plate and no dowel pins. This thread had had so many different things go on. Glad to see the 420g is progressing.

Is that v12 you got from an r129 by any chance? I would like to get an oil pan and pump from one to have In case I end up with a w140 v12 to possibly put in a w108 or w111.

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Roncallo · #**703** 02-09-2020, 09:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rwd4evr

Yes, I was referring to the done t5/560slc swap with regards to the plate and no dowel pins. This thread had had so many different things go on. Glad to see the 420g is progressing.

Is that v12 you got from an r129 by any chance? I would like to get an oil pan and pump from one to have In case I end up with a w140 v12 to possibly put in a w108 or w111.

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Its a 140 oil pan.

rwd4evr · #**704** 02-09-2020, 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roncallo

Its a 140 oil pan.

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Tony H · #**705** 02-20-2020, 02:35 AM

Took the auto bellhousing to the machine shop today and discussed with the owner. He said welding is not the best solution and could result in unpredictable results. He would machine off about .75" from the transmission mating surface(I calculated, depending on thickness of mounting plate), recreate the locating ring and fabricate a 1" (or .75") thick aluminum transmission mounting plate bolted to the bellhousing using the original auto trans mounting holes. If no mounting holes need to be tapped I can go thinner on the mounting plate. I will have a T5 transmission in a few days and can see how the mounting pattern interfaces with the MB bell and if any mounting holes are inaccessible/need tapping. The shop thinks they can do it for less than $1k.