Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help



Go Back   PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum > Mercedes-Benz Tech Information and Support > Diesel Discussion > Diesel Performance Tuning

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #121  
Old 11-07-2010, 01:16 PM
ashedd's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Seattle
Posts: 1,790
All of the 300e/260e's have the smaller yoke on the diff. The 87' 300d is the ONLY one that uses the w126 V8 size yokes. I assume it's because of the 603's torque.
You have two options:

Try to get a 300e yoke to fit on the 300d diff.

Have a custom shaft made that has two different size ends, what I did.

Sorry

__________________
08 R320 CDI current

Past
95 E420
87 300D Turbo 5spd
90 300TE
83 300SD
85 300TD
92 400E
85 190D

Reply With Quote
  #122  
Old 11-07-2010, 01:18 PM
ashedd's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Seattle
Posts: 1,790
Quote:
Originally Posted by winmutt View Post

Can I swap the tail piece from the auto to the manual? Or should I just have the back end of the DS chopped and weld the larger yoke on?
I tried that but could not get one of them off. It's pretty hard to do without the special socket. Maybe with an impact it would work.
__________________
08 R320 CDI current

Past
95 E420
87 300D Turbo 5spd
90 300TE
83 300SD
85 300TD
92 400E
85 190D

Reply With Quote
  #123  
Old 11-07-2010, 01:24 PM
ashedd's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Seattle
Posts: 1,790
And I just confirmed from gsxr's diff spread sheet that the rear shaft from the 400E we have at the junk yard here will not work. Uses r129 stuff.
__________________
08 R320 CDI current

Past
95 E420
87 300D Turbo 5spd
90 300TE
83 300SD
85 300TD
92 400E
85 190D

Reply With Quote
  #124  
Old 11-07-2010, 05:13 PM
gsxr's Avatar
Unbanned...?
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: USA
Posts: 8,102
Worse yet, the V8 driveshafts have the center support bearing in a different location. In other words, the lengths of the front & rear sections of the driveshafts are different between the 6-cyl W124' sedans and the V8 models. You can swap flanges on the transmission easily enough, but swapping the flangs on the diff is a bit of a gamble without the rotational torque measurement tool specified in the FSM. Some people just mark the nut and put it back to the same position, this isn't ideal but seems to work ok (but I wouldn't do this on my car, lol!).

Reply With Quote
  #125  
Old 11-07-2010, 06:47 PM
Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Cape Cod Massachusetts
Posts: 1,427
Quote:
Originally Posted by gsxr View Post
Worse yet, the V8 driveshafts have the center support bearing in a different location. In other words, the lengths of the front & rear sections of the driveshafts are different between the 6-cyl W124' sedans and the V8 models. You can swap flanges on the transmission easily enough, but swapping the flangs on the diff is a bit of a gamble without the rotational torque measurement tool specified in the FSM. Some people just mark the nut and put it back to the same position, this isn't ideal but seems to work ok (but I wouldn't do this on my car, lol!).

Offhand I'm not certain what the official "rotational torque measurement tool specified in the FSM" is but I've used this tool which works perfectly when determining pinion rotational torque.



It's a Craftsman Digital Rotational Torque Sensor #44599, which has a sensing head with 1/2" drive female and male connections and a separate digital display. It can read in ft/lbs 0 up to 150 and Nm to its eqivalent, with 1 1/2% accuracy across that range. It can be set to any point and it beeps quicker as you near the setting and buzzes when you hit it, it measures maximum rotational force (that is what one uses to determine the pinion rotational torque), it also measures and reads bidirectionally.

The strain sensor is supposedly not subject to drift over time or over moderate temp ranges, and is supposedly un-needing of re-calibration.

In addition to using it as an indicating torque wrench, I use it to check my mechanical torque wrenches against!

The only bad thing is it no longer available! Luckily when I bought mine it was on sale marked down from $140 to only $32 Clearance and I bought the last two they had hanging on my local store's racks.

I've seen them come up for sale on eBay from time to time, beyond the obvious does it turn on and display you need to make sure the number on the sensor is the same number the display has been calibrated for at the factory, used tool stores might have them also.
Reply With Quote
  #126  
Old 11-07-2010, 09:21 PM
DeliveryValve's Avatar
Chairman of my Benz
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Central California
Posts: 4,159
Quote:
Originally Posted by Billybob View Post
Offhand I'm not certain what the official "rotational torque measurement tool specified in the FSM" is but I've used this tool which works perfectly when determining pinion rotational torque.



It's a Craftsman Digital Rotational Torque Sensor #44599, which has a sensing head with 1/2" drive female and male connections and a separate digital display. It can read in ft/lbs 0 up to 150 and Nm to its eqivalent, with 1 1/2% accuracy across that range. ....

I don't think that would work. When reading the pinion rotation torque, you need it in inch pounds. Not ft/lbs. You'll get a reading somewhere in the neighborhood of around 20 inch pounds. Which translates to 1.67 ft/lbs.





.
__________________
1983 123.133 California
- GreaseCar Veg System


Reply With Quote
  #127  
Old 11-07-2010, 09:33 PM
Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Cape Cod Massachusetts
Posts: 1,427
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeliveryValve View Post
I don't think that would work. When reading the pinion rotation torque, you need it in inch pounds. Not ft/lbs. You'll get a reading somewhere in the neighborhood of around 20 inch pounds. Which translates to 1.67 ft/lbs..
It reads four characters with one decimal position. The objective is to get a reading of what exists and get back to that reading after tightening things up so the absolute accuracy is not so critical as is the repeatability of the measurement.
Reply With Quote
  #128  
Old 11-07-2010, 10:09 PM
gsxr's Avatar
Unbanned...?
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: USA
Posts: 8,102
That Craftsman unit is a very cool tool! But i think DV is correct... it may not provide enough resolution at the low readings required.

The old-style Stahlwille MB tool (shown here) reads from 0-400 N-cm (which would be 0-4 Nm). When I used it on my diff build, I remember the readings being between 50-150 N-cm. The new style tool (shown here) reads to 6Nm (600 N-cm) and can be used with the diff still in the car. Shame it costs nearly six hunnert bucks. (!) Never seen either of them for sale used, ever. Not many DIY people do that kind of serious diff work.

Reply With Quote
  #129  
Old 11-07-2010, 11:07 PM
DeliveryValve's Avatar
Chairman of my Benz
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Central California
Posts: 4,159
Quote:
Originally Posted by gsxr View Post
.... When I used it on my diff build, I remember the readings being between 50-150 N-cm. ....
Let me add the 20 inch pounds reading I quoted earlier was from the diff in the car with axles installed.

50-150 N-cm is most likely without axles installed.




.
__________________
1983 123.133 California
- GreaseCar Veg System


Reply With Quote
  #130  
Old 11-08-2010, 08:04 AM
winmutt's Avatar
85 300D 4spd+tow+h4
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Atl Gawga
Posts: 9,346
FWIW the cross member I got was the correct one and cost a whopping $32. I am sure you can get it through fastlane, I got mine from Rusty.
__________________
http://superturbodiesel.com/images/sig.04.10.jpg
1995 E420 Schwarz
1995 E300 Weiss
#1987 300D Sturmmachine
#1991 300D Nearly Perfect
#1994 E320 Cabriolet
#1995 E320 Touring
#1985 300D Sedan
OBK #42
Reply With Quote
  #131  
Old 11-08-2010, 10:21 AM
gsxr's Avatar
Unbanned...?
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: USA
Posts: 8,102
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeliveryValve View Post
Let me add the 20 inch pounds reading I quoted earlier was from the diff in the car with axles installed.

50-150 N-cm is most likely without axles installed.
That was with the diff on the workbench and ring gear+carrier removed... just the friction of the pinion bearings alone.

Reply With Quote
  #132  
Old 11-08-2010, 11:49 AM
ashedd's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Seattle
Posts: 1,790
gsxr,

I am about in the same boat here. Tell me the DIY/layman's way to swap the yokes between my 2.65 and the new 3.29 diff.

Also,

I am assuming I can just cap off the line on the diff for the limited slip? I do not plan on messing with that right now. Maybe down the road when it's diff clutch replacement time.

Thanks
__________________
08 R320 CDI current

Past
95 E420
87 300D Turbo 5spd
90 300TE
83 300SD
85 300TD
92 400E
85 190D

Reply With Quote
  #133  
Old 11-08-2010, 12:49 PM
gsxr's Avatar
Unbanned...?
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: USA
Posts: 8,102
Quote:
Originally Posted by ashedd View Post
I am about in the same boat here. Tell me the DIY/layman's way to swap the yokes between my 2.65 and the new 3.29 diff.
Basically you mark the position of the locknut relative to the pinion shaft, and when you install the new flange, tighten the nut back to where the marks line up. If it's too loose, you'll get bearing noise and/or additional driveline lash. If it's too tight, the bearings will wear out quickly, and you can't just loosen it a bit to "fix" it... the internal crush sleeve must be replaced (and that requires complete diff disassembly including removal of the pinion & bearings - not DIY).



Quote:
Originally Posted by ashedd View Post
I am assuming I can just cap off the line on the diff for the limited slip? I do not plan on messing with that right now. Maybe down the road when it's diff clutch replacement time.
You can only do that if you use the axle shafts from the 4Matic car. They are shorter to make room for the ASD hydraulic cylinders. Otherwise you'll need to swap the output flanges too... this is straightforward but requires taking the back cover off both diffs.

Last edited by gsxr; 11-08-2010 at 02:53 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #134  
Old 11-08-2010, 12:55 PM
Banned
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Texafornia
Posts: 5,493
Local guy in dallas has a 60x 5 er from another members little mistake--a w123 with the 200c euro drivetrain-or whatever the 4 cyl gasser designation was left side starter wart.

Last edited by panZZer; 11-08-2010 at 01:27 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #135  
Old 11-08-2010, 01:44 PM
ashedd's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Seattle
Posts: 1,790
Quote:
Originally Posted by gsxr View Post
Basically you mark the position of the locknut relative to the pinion shaft, and when you install the new flange, tighten the nut back to where the marks line up. If it's too loose, you'll get bearing noise and/or additional driveline lash. If it's too tight, the bearings will wear out quickly, and you can't just loosen it a bit to "fix" it... the internal crush sleeve must be replaced (and that requires complete diff disassembly including removal of the pinion & bearings - not DIY).




You can only do that if you use the axle shafts from the 4Matic car. They are shorter to make room for the ASD hydraulic cylinders. Otherwise you'll need to swap the output flanges too... this is straightforwart but requires taking the back cover off both diffs.


ok, I will swap output flanges and if/when the time comes I will get new 4matic axle shafts and go from there. I am starting to think I should have left the automatic in there and bought another supercoupe to shift gears with

__________________
08 R320 CDI current

Past
95 E420
87 300D Turbo 5spd
90 300TE
83 300SD
85 300TD
92 400E
85 190D

Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:48 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2024 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Peach Parts or Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page