Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help



Go Back   PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum > Mercedes-Benz Tech Information and Support > Diesel Discussion

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #46  
Old 07-20-2012, 12:54 AM
Diesel911's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Long Beach,CA
Posts: 53,419
you can see in your pic in post #41 it is the external Splines that stick out and make the OD larger; the splines get crushed during installation.
That is why it is not taking 25 tons to press it in.

What happend to installing the Grease Fittings on the new Ball Joints?

__________________
84 300D, 82 Volvo 244Gl Diesel
Reply With Quote
  #47  
Old 07-20-2012, 11:29 AM
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Blue Point, NY
Posts: 25,396
Quote:
Originally Posted by funola View Post
Positive on the Lemforder o.d. dimension.

The knuckle hole is a taper. I was only able to measure the bottom of the taper with the caliper so the dimension 1.770 is the smaller of the two.

Not sure if you can see the details in this pic. The one on the right is the old knocked out BJ, the vertical serration teeth has been crushed upon installation. Compare it to the new one on the left. I agree a lot of force is required to press it in. I got the Lemforder in with a lot of leverage. The Autozone press did the job and survived, but it's life will be limited. The threads on the ram screw is stripping. I was hoping the C clamp will not snap. It didn't. . The next time it probably will.

Thanks for the photos. As 911 mentioned, the splines relieve a lot of the load necessary to seat the joint.

The use of that tool is fine with the proviso that the boot is removed. Originally, I thought, based upon other discussions, that the tool imparted the force through the ball, but it clearly does not.

Due to the configuration of the spindle, a shop would require special adaptors to reach into the spindle and hydraulically press the joint. A typical shop such as ours could not perform that task without those tools.

That clamp seems quite strong for the task..........although the force is still significant.............it's clearly nowhere near 50K lbs.
Reply With Quote
  #48  
Old 07-20-2012, 11:33 AM
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Blue Point, NY
Posts: 25,396
Quote:
Originally Posted by Diesel911 View Post
If your press is tall enough you can use the Installation Tool Below; there is a thread on it.
It is 100+ dollars now but much cheper than the Klann Tool.
It also comes with a big Punch to remove the Ball Joint.
Is it a straight line from the top of the spindle to the centerline of the joint? It appears that the joint is recessed slightly and you'd need some type of "C" to get in there????
Reply With Quote
  #49  
Old 07-20-2012, 12:25 PM
funola's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: NYC
Posts: 8,245
Quote:
Originally Posted by Diesel911 View Post
............................

What happend to installing the Grease Fittings on the new Ball Joints?
I have decided it was not worthwhile doing (on my 83 300D) due to lower BJ's long lives, where the RF started squeaking at 250K, LF at 290K. Since I replaced them with good quality Lemforder BJs, if they last 3/4 as long, would outlast the body rust for sure.

I may try to install grease nipples in situ in my pristine 85 300D, which has 157k and the lower BJ's are still good.
__________________
85 300D turbo pristine w 157k when purchased 161K now
83 300 D turbo 297K runs great. SOLD!
83 240D 4 spd manual- parted out then junked
Reply With Quote
  #50  
Old 07-20-2012, 12:37 PM
funola's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: NYC
Posts: 8,245
Quote:
Originally Posted by Diesel911 View Post
If your press is tall enough you can use the Installation Tool Below; there is a thread on it.
It is 100+ dollars now but much cheper than the Klann Tool.
It also comes with a big Punch to remove the Ball Joint.
The pic of the tool you posted looks like it has a cutout in the long tube to clear the bend in the spindle. It does not appear it will be able to get a straight shot of the BJ flange due to the angle of the bend in the spindle. I would like to see some pics of the tool with the spindle/BJ setup in a hydraulic press.

I considered making a (knock in BJ) punch with a long 2" dia. pipe with a cutout and determined it was not possible to get a straight shot due to the bend in the spindle.
__________________
85 300D turbo pristine w 157k when purchased 161K now
83 300 D turbo 297K runs great. SOLD!
83 240D 4 spd manual- parted out then junked
Reply With Quote
  #51  
Old 07-20-2012, 12:56 PM
funola's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: NYC
Posts: 8,245
Please post your results if you try my red-neck lower ball joint removal method. I understand some ball joints are tougher to knock out than others depending on how much rust is in there. This one came from a 83 240D with 221K, east coast car which had structural rust, sent to the scrappers but the lower BJ was not that badly rusted in. I did wire brush the seams to get some penetrating oil in there and I am sure that helped. What really worked well was how solidly the knuckle was supported by the earth. I did not swing the hammer all that hard, maybe 30% of max that I am capable of. I took a series of small strikes that produced movement. I recall (about 2 years ago), just propping the knuckle upright in a corner and striking with all my might which produced zero results. The knuckle would just bounce and land on the ground.

I would suggest burying it deeper than in this pic, where the earth was dry. Don't forget a plate (or a rock that won't crack) to spread out the load. I used this method again in the same hole (same depth) the next day after it had rained and while it still worked ok, was shifting off center with each hammer strike.


__________________
85 300D turbo pristine w 157k when purchased 161K now
83 300 D turbo 297K runs great. SOLD!
83 240D 4 spd manual- parted out then junked
Reply With Quote
  #52  
Old 07-20-2012, 06:32 PM
funola's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: NYC
Posts: 8,245
This is the ball joint press

116 589 04 62 00

called for in the FSM.

I don't like the way that weld looks on the lower jaw, do you?

$395 from Samstag Mercedes Tools - Mercedes Benz Special Tools & Repair Information-Tool

__________________
85 300D turbo pristine w 157k when purchased 161K now
83 300 D turbo 297K runs great. SOLD!
83 240D 4 spd manual- parted out then junked
Reply With Quote
  #53  
Old 07-20-2012, 09:18 PM
Diesel911's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Long Beach,CA
Posts: 53,419
Quote:
Originally Posted by funola View Post
The pic of the tool you posted looks like it has a cutout in the long tube to clear the bend in the spindle. It does not appear it will be able to get a straight shot of the BJ flange due to the angle of the bend in the spindle. I would like to see some pics of the tool with the spindle/BJ setup in a hydraulic press.

I considered making a (knock in BJ) punch with a long 2" dia. pipe with a cutout and determined it was not possible to get a straight shot due to the bend in the spindle.
The JTC Tool Works; there is a very good thread on it by one of our Members and a nice pictorial in the Axle section of the DIY.

It does indeed have a cut out and that is what allows it to go on straight.
__________________
84 300D, 82 Volvo 244Gl Diesel
Reply With Quote
  #54  
Old 07-20-2012, 09:20 PM
Diesel911's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Long Beach,CA
Posts: 53,419
Quote:
Originally Posted by funola View Post
This is the ball joint press

116 589 04 62 00

called for in the FSM.

I don't like the way that weld looks on the lower jaw, do you?

$395 from Samstag Mercedes Tools - Mercedes Benz Special Tools & Repair Information-Tool

One of our Members made the tool in the Pic; that is also in one of our threads.
Attached Thumbnails
Red neck lower ball joint removal-ball-joint-press-home-made-m.jpg  
__________________
84 300D, 82 Volvo 244Gl Diesel
Reply With Quote
  #55  
Old 07-20-2012, 09:28 PM
Diesel911's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Long Beach,CA
Posts: 53,419
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Carlton View Post
Is it a straight line from the top of the spindle to the centerline of the joint? It appears that the joint is recessed slightly and you'd need some type of "C" to get in there????
I am not sure but I think this is the thread on the JTC-1849 Ball Joint installer and some other related tools. Anyway it is what I had in my Notes.

Write up - Ball Joints & Lower Control Arm Bushings & Tool Review (PICS!)

there might be 2 threads
http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/showthread.php?t=179284&highlight=JTC
__________________
84 300D, 82 Volvo 244Gl Diesel
Reply With Quote
  #56  
Old 07-23-2012, 10:01 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 167
Quote:
Originally Posted by tarnbarn View Post
They do come out easy with a hammer don't they. You'd have got a bonus point if you'd kept the nut on the end , saving the thread from any possiblity of damage...
Mine would not budge with a lot of heat and wild flailing hits with a big sledge hammer and a suitable dolly held by an assistant.

I got a used steering knuckle with a good ball joint already in it, put fresh grease on it and used a new boot.

infinitely easier when they are badly stuck, which the deifinately can be.

Last edited by Rocket99; 07-23-2012 at 10:02 PM. Reason: spelling
Reply With Quote
  #57  
Old 07-23-2012, 10:30 PM
DeliveryValve's Avatar
Chairman of my Benz
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Central California
Posts: 4,159
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Carlton View Post
...
The use of that tool is fine with the proviso that the boot is removed. Originally, I thought, based upon other discussions, that the tool imparted the force through the ball, but it clearly does not.
....
On certain other brand joints, that is the case. They use a thin metal covering that gets crushed with the press. But with the Lemforder it's part of the solid base.


.
__________________
1983 123.133 California
- GreaseCar Veg System


Reply With Quote
  #58  
Old 07-23-2012, 10:43 PM
Diesel911's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Long Beach,CA
Posts: 53,419
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocket99 View Post
Mine would not budge with a lot of heat and wild flailing hits with a big sledge hammer and a suitable dolly held by an assistant.

I got a used steering knuckle with a good ball joint already in it, put fresh grease on it and used a new boot.

infinitely easier when they are badly stuck, which the deifinately can be.
They can be stuck in hard enough that one of our Members took a cutting Torch and cut a hole in the center but leaving enough for the Joint to be punched out.
That is a pretty extreme measure.

I can just imagine the frustration of someone reading several DIYs where the Joint came out easily and having His particular Joint in solidly
__________________
84 300D, 82 Volvo 244Gl Diesel
Reply With Quote
  #59  
Old 07-23-2012, 11:50 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 1,269
It's not much of a redneck method. I think every balljoint replacement I've seen has used a sledgehammer to knock them out.

The proper press makes short work of installing them, and no boot removal necessary. Not particularly practical for a single use, but if you're a shop doing these regularly it makes the job a million times easier.
Reply With Quote
  #60  
Old 07-24-2012, 09:29 AM
funola's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: NYC
Posts: 8,245
Quote:
Originally Posted by colincoon View Post
It's not much of a redneck method. I think every balljoint replacement I've seen has used a sledgehammer to knock them out.

The proper press makes short work of installing them, and no boot removal necessary. Not particularly practical for a single use, but if you're a shop doing these regularly it makes the job a million times easier.
Ahhh, the red neck part is not the hammer, but the innovative method the knuckle is held and supported.

__________________
85 300D turbo pristine w 157k when purchased 161K now
83 300 D turbo 297K runs great. SOLD!
83 240D 4 spd manual- parted out then junked
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:46 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2024 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Peach Parts or Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page