Really looking for a diesel, but would settle for a nice LWB gasser. Found two local MBs (well, one is local actually) - just trying to decide which would be better of the two. I am pretty familiar with the common problem on both (making sure the timing chain/rails/guides on the V8 is up to date and the headgasket, valve seals, etc on the I6 is well, etc. Chassis wise, I know both are pretty solid cars.

The 88' 420SEL - 190K miles, blue on blue, nice interior, NO rust, runs great (he said better than great), but paint on top is poor (faded) - 1-owner car - still waiting to hear from the seller to see if records show chain/guides/rails have been replaced. He wants $2500 FIRM for it. (The car belonged to a relative of his that bought it brand new).

The other is a 88' 300SEL with 157K miles. Stated to run very well. No rust, good paint, good interior etc, but I am not sure of mechanical details. I THINK I can get this one for about $2800-$3200, but I would have to pay an additional $300 for shipping.

OR... my uncle found a nice 1982 300SD, with 174K miles - (according to ad) NO rust, nice interior, runs super, clean (but not detailed engine bay), all lights, gauges, windows, locks, etc work perfectly, no suspension or steering issues, no engine problems, COLD A/C, air comes out of proper locations, no leaks, all records, always serviced at MB dealer or specialist, etc. I THINK I can get this one for about $2500-3000, but again - this is about a $500 shipping charge added to it. Reliability and service wise, I think this would be the winner?

Since the 420SEL is very local (may look at it Sunday), I am leaning more toward it and its lower in price, but from what the seller told me, its a nice, well maintained car - BUT I know it will use alot more fuel than the 300SEL and the 300SD and I have heard alot of transmission issues on the 86-91 W126 gassers.... but maybe its not that big of a problem.

I wonder if the 88 300SEL has the same transmission as the 420SEL? Does anyone know?

Thanks!

Yes, same transmission - 722.3xx, very stout, but they're 20+ years old, lots of miles, hard to tell what might be in line for a rebuild.

The V8 and the six will use the same tranny, with a few subtle differences, like shift points, modulator pressure, etc. It's the 722.3xx.
First time I have heard of these cars having common tranny problems.
My reverse plates did wear down at the 170k mile mark or so, but that's the only common issue I've heard with them.
As far as gas mileage, I bet you won't be able to tell the difference between the 8 and 6 cars. The 300 is geared so low it only gets 19-20 on the road, and 15 in town. Actual EPA rating on the 6 is 15-19. I bet the 8 will do that good.
The six is really easy to work on, and adequate around town, but it revs like crazy on the road with that short gearing. tends to use up belt-driven accessories, cause it revs so high (3500 at 70 mph).
Can't comment on the diesel, never been in one.

DG

Their all ancient, buy whatever one is in the best shape and you like the best.

The SD is the same car as your 380SE.

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1999 SL500
1969 280SE
2023 Ram 1500
2007 Tiara 3200

Oh yes... ancient indeed - the newest one is 20 years old! Well, I will know more when I look at the 420SEL on Sunday. If the timing chain/guides/rails have not been changed (written receipts/verification), I am going to offer $500 less so I can have those replaced ASAP and not have that guessing game like I had with my 380SE. Since the 300SEL has the least number of miles and appears the nicest it may be a good choice.

The seller of the 300SD has other Mercedes for sale and all seem to have a very similiar description in the write-ups, BUT they are all very nice cars and seems to have a good rep.. so there.

Thanks for the tips/replies.

Well my 126 roster goes as this:

84' 300SD....312K Slow off line but on the highway she's pretty nice. Avg 29mpg. Great Gas mileage for being this old and I love the black smoke.
85' 380SE Gray market.... 134K avg 19mpg. Fast off line and geared high. This for me is my toy
91' 560SEC.... 89K 19mpg. Newest acquisition. This is one quick puppy
92' 500E.... 24K Km Well what can you say.... it's a 500E.... and stays in the garage unless it's sunny outside....

__________________
"Why operate within the law when you can operate above it?"

MB roster
'85 500SE euro Ratrod
'92 500E's x2 / '94 E500 stored
'91 560SEC w/43K stored
'92 Cabby 16V OE 2.1 AutoX car
JDM RHD cars now.

They seem to all be approximately equal description-wise. I would recommend the one that has the best maintenance rercords. The shipping charge will comne back to you in reduced maintenance cost.

Don't give up on the diesel though.

The diesel has the toughest motor of all the W126 cars.

If there is no records on the timing chain for the gasser, I would estimate dinging the price for $1500, about what I think a good shop would charge for a COMPLETE good job.

They do need a new chain, guide rails and tensioner at 100k, so they are due if not done.


I would estimate an average W126 transmission to be good for 250k, they are robust, if well kept up will go lots further than that

Drive all the cars. See if you like the diesel. If it is an SD it will be the short wheelbase on though

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1991 560 SEC AMG, 199k <---- 300 hp 10:1 ECE euro HV ...

1995 E 420, 170k "The Red Plum" (sold)

2015 BMW 535i xdrive awd Stage 1 DINAN, 6k, <----364 hp

1967 Mercury Cougar, 49k

2013 Jaguar XF, 20k <----340 hp Supercharged, All Wheel Drive (sold)

And if you can come up with just one more significant price ding he'll have to pay you. Or if indeed the price is firm at $2500 just pretend the price is $4,000 and then ding it for $1500. Same formula for any other price dings you come up with.

Thanks. Well the owner of the 420SEL was trying to get that info for me. He tried phoning that evening, but I was out... then I tried to return the call and his cell was getting wretched reception... I worked late tonight, then onto a bunch of errands, but I will try to find out tomorrow. The car has 190K I think, so its probably due for it again.

The 300SD or 300SEL I know can go longer without these items safely and its not as big as a deal as it is on the V8s.

Then I found a couple of 500SEL models (1992 and 1993), but both have about 200K and probably due for the chains/rails, etc as well.

I have an 84 500SEL with aprox 250K miles. I have a friend with an 87 300SDL w/350K miles. Both great cars. I use mine mostly for trips and special ocasions. He uses his for work (realitor). I think both cars are well suited for their respective jobs. The 500 uses more fuel but is much nicer on the road. The 300 is fine for either but not as plesant on long trips. So, the job at hand needs to be considered. I am willing to pay the extra for fuel to ride in the 500 gas car. By the way, I also have a 92 300D 2.5 as a daily driver. It gets 25 mpg in all city driving and 32 on the highway but I still drive the 500 at 19-20 mpg on the road.

Paul

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84 500 SEL (307,xxx miles)

Thanks. Well my only concern on the 500SEL I found is oil usage.... seller has to add oil every 2K? I wonder how common oil usage is on a early 90s 5.0L Benz? My old 3.8L did not even use a drop between the 3K changes and it had 275K.

Then I found a 1994 S420. Appears to be stunning, but the seller said that the HVAC unit was bad, needs crank sensor, rear window motors and steering sector..... $3700 - so not sure if I want to put all of that money into that.

I had the 300SEL, and I have had a couple diesels (W123) and I can say that the 300SEL really does rev HIGH on the freeway! At first I thought that my trans was stuck in third! The power is also a bit low (to me anyway) and the diesel will have even less.

So basically, the I6 is pretty quiet, but revs high on the highway, still gets pretty decent MPG. The diesel is loud on the highway, and also revs pretty high. The V8 is really quiet, lots of power, and revs low pretty much all the time lol. The only drawback is maintenance and MPG.

It's all about what you want, and what you are willing to compromise!

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Current cars:
2000 ML55 AMG, 174k miles
2003 C240 T-Modell, 202k miles
1995 S320, 207k Miles

Thanks. Well, I found a fairly local 1988 300SEL with 101K that I think I can buy for $2100. Nice car overall. Runs great according to the owner.

I would like to have the diesel for MPG, but wanting a LWB model, but the diesel LWB models are hard to find in the price range I am looking for. The V8s sound nice... I liked mine, but always concerned with the timing chain/components issue, so I am leaning more toward the 88+ 300SEL, since it has the LWB and a relatively reliable engine and easy to work on. I know that these have the occasional headgasket/oil burning issue, but hoping this local 88' does not have those issues. Supposed to not have and at only 101K, it should be OK. I hope.

Thanks again!

Trans issues you have heard are BS, I have 260k on one that's stock. Shifts slow into Reverse but upshifts are fine. Just change the fluid every other year or 25k and you'll be fine. The trans shifts firm, just how it is...

420sel is what to buy! I own variants of all you're interested in... and I am seeking a prime 420 for my condo actually. They're a BARGAIN for what you get. Well I'd take an ECE 500sel too. 420s are nearly as quick as 500s due to less weight... same with the 560.

Unless you brew Bio, Diesel isn't worth it due to cost of fuel (cost per mile). Economy simply isn't THAT much better anyway. They only get upper 20s at best, unless you drive 55-60mph. I've gotten 29-31 more than once in my SD and SDL but that was 65mph cruise in the fall (AC off) and those have 2.88:1 diffs. For $1/gal more... you can do better and reap the benefits of more power. The pretty flat torque is great if you do quite a bit of city driving.

300sel is a quirky vehicle, buzzes down the freeway, 2nd gear start. Decent freeway car if you're a slow freeway driver, poor in the city (get a few people in there, have AC on, fan clutch locked, start in 2nd gear... and it's a turd) Geared wrong, needs a 2.88:1 with first gear start and economy is so-so as S-Class pointed out. A 420sel will match it in economy (if not surpass) if driven modestly (65mph freeway)... with an extra 40ft-lbs of torque ~1000rpm sooner (and about 25hp more up top) which is massive for normal driving.

The M103 will always need a valve job between 150-200k due to freeway RPM (I wouldn't want a primarily driven city car). Cheap and easy, but factor it in. One guy has swapped in a 2.88:1 here and loves it. I'll be doing the same when I put a 2.47:1 in my SDL. OH - my 300sel drinks 1 quart in about 250 miles... 260k on the ticker with new valve seals.

Timing guides are easy on the V8s, just time consuming. The M116 you can get updated alu guides that won't fail again. If you're in a pinch for time, do the driver side first as that's the side that fails.

Diesel's one advantage is the lack of countless vac tubes, housings, etc that go bad on the gas motors. But fix those and you're good.



Buy the one with the best paint and interior. Any of your choices will require a few thousand to be put in.



Skip that W140. HVAC issues are HUGE on those.

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I'm not a doctor, but I'll have a look.

'85 300SD 245k
'87 300SDL 251k
'90 300SEL 326k

Six others from BMW, GM, and Ford.

Liberty will not descend to a people; a people must raise themselves to liberty.[/IMG]