300SDL in shop....need advice!!!!! - Page 3 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

boneheaddoctor · #31 06-22-2005, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Habanero

I guess I should have said weight (or pressure) of the lobe of the cam. Since it was no longer attached to anything, I was curious if it would still hold down with enough force to really do major damage or just get pushed up out of the way by the valve when the piston hit it. I was thinking specifically under the condition of just turning over with the starter.

Well it would determine exactly where the cam snapped...but I would guess if one end was free the other end was still ina cam tower bearing...and that would have leverage to hold a valve open...or it it snapped and was still supported at both ends of the then you would have more points capible of holding a valve open...no point in working yourself into an ulcer untill you look....there is always a possibility that by blind luck the valves were closed when it broke...and whatever was done is done.

dieseldiehard · #32 06-22-2005, 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 300sdlguy

It appears the previous mechanic somehow broke the camshaft, at it was this that was causing the two rear cyl's not to function. I will probably have to sue for the damage, and at this point it probably not worth it, so another $875 the repair.

Sheesh, the thought that it might be the cam was something that occurred to m but I didn't want to give you anything to worry about, I know whatever it was would come out in time.
The shop that put the head back on should ante up (or I hope you take him to court!)

300sdlguy · #33 07-06-2005, 09:43 PM

Mechanic called to state Cam is in, runs on all cyl's, but smokes like heck, after examination he finds the IP needing to be timed and reset at a tune of $395. Does this sound reasonable? I am now going to be OVER $1500.

Brian Carlton · #34 07-06-2005, 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 300sdlguy

Mechanic called to state Cam is in, runs on all cyl's, but smokes like heck, after examination he finds the IP needing to be timed and reset at a tune of $395. Does this sound reasonable? I am now going to be OVER $1500.

Well, naturally, the IP needs to be timed after a head installation.

But, $395.00

It's two hours labor, maximum. Less if he has the proper RIV tool.

Sounds like pricing at Wal-Mart. Ask him why it's not $399.99??

300sdlguy · #35 07-06-2005, 10:05 PM

That's what I thought, but how do you actually talk to a mechanic who is over charging you? I always fear this is exactly the type to sabotage your vehicle. I hate that I am sounding paranoid.

Brian Carlton · #36 07-06-2005, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 300sdlguy

That's what I thought, but how do you actually talk to a mechanic who is over charging you? I always fear this is exactly the type to sabotage your vehicle. I hate that I am sounding paranoid.

First: Ask him to show you the RIV tool. It's a small plastic box with a couple of lights on it. Red and yellow IIRC. If he does not have the tool, thank him very much and take the vehicle out of the shop. DO NOT allow him to set the injection timing.

If he does have the tool, ask him to see it. Once you confirm that he has it, then ask him, point blank, how long it will take him to set timing. If he says anything more than two hours then ask him exactly what he has to do.

It involves loosening the IP and rotating it either toward or away from the engine while observing the RIV tool. Sometimes the hard lines can be a PITA but, it should be easily done in two hours. If he says that it takes him four hours (about right for $395) then thank him very much and take the vehicle out of the shop.

If he comes up with any other explanation for the four hours in time, then he might be doing other things, in addition to simply setting the IP timing. If so, then you must report back as to exactly what else he wants to do.

sixto · #37 07-06-2005, 10:19 PM

As I read this thread my initial suspicion was that the -14- prechambers didn't seal properly against the -18- head (are you sure it's not -19-?).

$400 to time an IP sounds steep but maybe that's the book rate. The A-B tool is about $250. It doesn't take an hour to set an IP unless it has to come off to reset it relative to the timer. At that point it might be quicker to remove the vacuum pump and tensioner and reset the timer.

IP timing shouldn't be too far off if he didn't pull the IP. He shouldn't have pulled the IP to replace the head.

Sixto
95 S420
87 300SDL

sixto · #38 07-06-2005, 10:22 PM

Hmm... maybe $395 includes diagnosis to conclude the IP needs to be timed.

I would expect a reasonable shop to have the proper MB IP timing light, not just an A-B box. You can set IP timing to the accuracy of the A-B box using an IP lock. Even that can be done in an hour.

Sixto
95 S420
87 300SDL

300sdlguy · #39 07-06-2005, 11:15 PM

I will try and get more info tomorrow. I know that the IP was not pulled when the head was replaced.

You are good SIXTO....I forgot to mention the two of the prechamber's were not seated properly and he corrected that which brings my total to $1200. Then I believe he said he'd have to remove the IP time it the set it back in place.

Also, is the RIV pronounced R I V each letter separately or RIV like the beginning of Riviera? Just want to make sure I say it right.

sixto · #40 07-07-2005, 12:02 AM

RIV = reference impulse verification.

Actually the timing light isn't a timing light but a digital display of start of delivery. The device has a sensor at the IP and a sensor at the crank pulley. It provides a numeric readout, not a flash of light.

Sixto
95 S420
87 300SDL

300sdlguy · #41 07-17-2006, 02:48 PM

Today I picked up the 300 SDL, on several occasions this past year, I checked on the car and the mechanic would tell me that it wasn't running just right and he wanted to do some "tinkering" with it to get it to smooth-out and stop the smoke at idle, I assumed this was AFTER he corrected the IP timing. Well OVER a year later I finally told him we needed to either figure it out or let me have it back. He stated he felt there was too much unknown about the car and he was not willing to go further and not get the desired results, hmmm, sure doesn't think much of his ability to diagnose or repair. He had the head off he should have been able to see or check things over befor putting it back together. I never gave him a limit on cost or anything, I wonder if he just didn't have the ability to make the car run right period. Basically all that he did was put in a new camshaft and said if I would pay $500 of what was an $1100 bill with the labor we'd call it even. I agreed just to get it over with. When I took a look at the reciept, he notes in his comments that the engine smokes excessively & has a stong smell of partially burned fuel, requiring the removal of the injector pump to remedy, at a cost of $395. But for some reason he never did the timing. I assume he didn't have the ability or the proper tools to do this, but not sure why he left it on the comments on my receipt. At this point the engine smokes a blue-ish white-ish smoke that gets less white and more black as you drive it. When under acceleration the smoke lessens considerably. When the car is at idle is has a definite miss-like quality to it, but when you rev it up its smooth as silk...sorta like it was PRIOR to having ANY of the work done. Not sure where to go from here, who to trust anymore, not really feeling good about what used to be my favorite toy. The head is rebuilt, the injectors are new, the camshaft is new. Is the cost of $395 to time the injector pump reasonable and/or the going rate for this? Can anyone recommend a reasonably priced and competent 603 Diesel Mechanic in the Dallas are?

pawoSD · #42 07-17-2006, 02:49 PM

Wow....I would just try and locate a reputable MB dealership in the area...I would expect there'd be many in the Dallas or Chicago areas.....

They'd be able to do the best job, unless you can find a real "euro/MB" private shop. A quick online yellowpages search or the local phone book should yield some results I would imagine...

Brian Carlton · #43 07-17-2006, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 300sdlguy

When the car is at idle is has a definite miss-like quality to it, but when you rev it up its smooth as silk...sorta like it was PRIOR to having ANY of the work done.

Setting the IP timing won't affect this situation.

The miss must be identified.

I was looking for the results of the compression check.........but........could not find them. Was this done after the cam was replaced?

Barry has some good results with the millivolt check method for determining the temperature of the burn inside the cylinders. If you've got a cylinder that's giving you problems, this method would be ideal for determining which cylinder is the culprit. Then, you can troubleshoot by swapping injectors or doing a compression test on that cylinder.

resago · #44 07-17-2006, 04:04 PM

I'm sure you know this, but white-blue smoke is oil, black smoke is running rich.

did your mechanic make any observation of the rings or sleeves?
How is your blowby?

if you want to live with the oil smoke, you should be able to adjust the fuel delivery yourself.

just my .02

Brian Carlton · #45 07-17-2006, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by resago

I'm sure you know this, but white-blue smoke is oil,

........which begs another question..........anyone check out the turbo for bad seals.........something that I'm all to familiar with.

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