w124 - dealer says coolant leaking from cylinder bolt - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

richard28 · #1 10-17-2012, 12:41 PM

My son's 1988 300ce is at the dealer after major coolant loss while driving. He needed a loaner, so car towed to Dealer in Los Angeles. The initial report is coolant leaking from an engine/cylinder bolt, and they are still looking at it. [I hoped it was just the hose from engine to heating core, but no such luck.] My son reported there was no oil in the coolant or reservoir, or water in the oil. Could this be a blown headgasket? If so, my inclination is to dispose of the car, the repair cost just is not justifiable on such an old car.

Thoughts?

Richard

JamesDean · #2 10-17-2012, 01:52 PM

As I understood it there is a defect in the M103/M104 headgaskets. That effected ALL engines and it was more a matter of WHEN rather an IF an m103/104 was going to need a new gasket.

When my 2.6's went it started to seep oil out near the #6 cylinder. My shop quoted me about $1200 for the whole job. My friend had his M104 done for about the same.

Cost justification is a matter of personal opinion. I opted to have a 3.0L m103 dropped in, it too will need a headgasket in probably 50-75k. I'll probably just have it done at that point. or swap an m104 in

JohnM. · #3 10-17-2012, 02:40 PM

I don't think coolant can leak from a cylinder bolt, but I could be wrong.

It is very rare for the M103 headgasket to fail in such a fashion, just coolant loss with no oil in coolant or vice versa.

I really want to say its a rubber hose that failed and the dealer is being daft. Did they check the hose at the lower drivers side of the block? I wouldn't throw in the towel until I see a compression/leakdown check.

richard28 · #4 10-17-2012, 03:01 PM

JohnM,
On my 1987 300e I had the coolant leak from the hose you mentioned, and replacing it fixed the issue. Based on your note I emailed the dealer's service advisor to have the shop check that hose too.

richard28 · #5 10-17-2012, 05:43 PM

Well, the LA dealer said it's the freeze-out plug under the exhaust manifold, needing 6 hours labor and $300 parts (incl gaskets & antifreeze) to replace. I called my indie, Willy in Great Neck,NY is brilliant, who originally got the diagnosis 100% correct; & he said it should cost about $300 to replace.

JohnM. · #6 10-17-2012, 06:01 PM

Better than a headgasket.

richard28 · #7 10-17-2012, 06:06 PM

The freeze-out plug is the name for the nozzle-like thing one loosens to drain the antifreeze from the block, right? It's a pain to reach, you'd think it could have been engineered in a more convenient place.

dynalow · #8 10-17-2012, 07:08 PM

When I purchased my '88 300CE in FL in 2001, a PPI revealed an external oil leak at the rear of the head. (The seller & I split the INDY cost). At the time the car had 41,000 miles on the odo. Last year, 90,000 miles later, my dealer tells me the head gasket is leaking again. My indy friend says, pffft, nothing to worry about. Same location, however, as the first leak.

James Dean is correct about the design/manufacturing flaw on the original gasket on the M103.

To Richard28, how is the oil consumption? The valve stem seals are another "gonna go sometime" job. You will know by the increased consumpton. Mine got to burning a qt. halfway between oil changes. Cheap enough to repair though. Changed them at about 75,000 iirc. Been a while though.

Another thing: here is an old thread for 300CE owners. Many of the old timers have move on. Some are still here.

Some useful info from CE owners.

300CE/E320 Coupe owners Roll Call!

BTW, your son is driving a pretty safe car.

A former forum member, Texholdem, rolled his in a Texas highway accident some years back. I can't find the thread, but I copied a couple of pics he posted. IIRC, the car rolled over 3 times with his wife and kids in the car. It came to rest on the roof, he opened the door and the famile got out basically uninjured.

JohnM. · #9 10-17-2012, 08:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by richard28

The freeze-out plug is the name for the nozzle-like thing one loosens to drain the antifreeze from the block, right? It's a pain to reach, you'd think it could have been engineered in a more convenient place.

The only time it should really ever be used is during a cylinder head removal, and the exhaust manifolds are removed for easier access to that.

richard28 · #10 10-18-2012, 11:19 AM

Dynalow: I've had the valve stem seals replaced, and the tranny rebuilt; the car is still a delight to drive. I bought it about 6 years ago for my son, for its safety & design.

JohnM: I recall the Haynes Manual and/or posters here advising opening the freeze-out plug to drain coolant from the block; it was a pain to get the wrench in between the manifold pipes, that I do remember.

dubadaddy · #11 10-18-2012, 12:29 PM

I would take it to MR MB Motors in Tarzana for a second opinion. He is the best indie in the LA area. Highly recommended. Honest and reliable. Has done all of my head work and major work on any my MB cars.

richard28 · #12 10-18-2012, 12:37 PM

Yesterday afternoon, I arranged for Enrique to receive the car and check it out today.

ds190 · #13 10-18-2012, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by richard28

The freeze-out plug is the name for the nozzle-like thing one loosens to drain the antifreeze from the block, right?

No, the freeze plugs and the block drain plug are two different things. The drain plug, used to drain coolant out of the block when changing it every 30K miles, is not hard to reach at all.

The freeze plugs (4) have to be pounded in with a drift, requiring the removal of the exhaust manifold for the two on that side.

ah-kay · #14 10-18-2012, 03:21 PM

Freeze plugs are to plug the holes when the engine is casted. Most, if not all, engines have freeze plugs. 99% of the time freeze plugs leak due to rust and neglected coolant change. The rust inhibitor in the coolant prevents them from rusting and hence leak.

Some cars have freeze plug between the engine and tranny. Go figure how much it costs to fix in labor. Part is only $1 or less. If one freeze plug leaks then the chance the other will leak is pretty high.

Good luck.

http://www.automedia.com/Replacing_a_Freeze_Plug/ccr20070401fp/1

ps2cho · #15 10-19-2012, 02:31 AM

I had to replace the freeze plug on my 300TE.

The above is correct about not using the correct Zerex G-05 coolant. That or MB coolant is the ONLY coolant you should be using -- along with distilled water.

6hrs labor? Gotta be kiddin.... You can access it, albeit a little tricky without removing anything. Its probably leaking at the same one in my pic (left one).

Here's where it is. You can see I replaced it. Ignore the arrow