1979 240D - Can't get fuel through injector hard lines - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Diesel911 · #16 04-11-2019, 08:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MyOld240D

Alright, I tried re-priming the pump and I still can't get fuel to come through. I'll pull the delivery valve when I get a chance to look at the plungers. I have my eyes on a replacement injection pump as a last resort - but if I can get this one going, I'll be happy as a clam. Can't put all the other pieces back on the car until that engine is running.

I'm concerned that it isn't rotating at all for some reason, is there a way to see if the camshaft is actually turning when I crank the engine?

I may or may not be missing some kind of union between the IP and the block.. Any chance someone has maybe an exploded diagram of the union between the IP and the engine?

Just concentrate on getting fuel to come out to one cylinder. If you can get one to work do one at a time after that.

MyOld240D · #17 04-12-2019, 06:53 PM

SO LET ME TELL YOU A STORY OF MY LAST 2 HOURS AFTER I GOT HOME FROM WORK

So I freed up the plungers, cleaned the pump out with cotton swabs and some ATF on every delivery valve holder.

I got fuel from the pump after cleaning the sludge out of it. The car started and idled for about 30 seconds and then the engine ran away.

Blew a hole in the injection pump

and I had to PULL MY PANTS DOWN AND SIT ON THE INTAKE MANIFOLD to starve the engine of air.

I removed the pump and tried to run the engine by pouring diesel down the manifold. Engine started and idled fine for 15 seconds before my wife stopped pouring diesel.

So I have now ordered an injection pump and linkages from a guy on eBay (parted out from a wrecked car)

Im covered in diesel, motor oil and have a large cut on my hand from a piece of shrapnel, A LARGE RED WELT ON MY ASSCHEEK FROM THE SUCTION and so is the car completely coated in fluids... and some got on my Jetta Sportwagen (where I keep my tools)... (I hope it doesn't stain the paint!)

I got lucky and didn't destroy my engine. Don't **** with injection pumps when you have no idea what you're doing. I've done injectors, engine swaps, transmission work and at least 100 valve adjustments (put close to 150k miles on 240Ds over the years) and am an experienced mechanic but will never **** with an injection pump again... Lesson learned very quickly.

I'll update this thread once the car is alive... but may have some questions when I get the new pump/linkages (I think my linkage was not setup right, and I was missing a few parts....)

Another fun story for the project car archive eh?

The things we do for these cars... it's an addiction and a labor of love... the neighbors will not stop laughing, one brought over a beer to ease my pain

Diesel911 · #18 04-12-2019, 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MyOld240D

SO LET ME TELL YOU A STORY OF MY LAST 2 HOURS AFTER I GOT HOME FROM WORK

So I freed up the plungers, cleaned the pump out with cotton swabs and some ATF on every delivery valve holder.

I got fuel from the pump after cleaning the sludge out of it. The car started and idled for about 30 seconds and then the engine ran away.

Blew a hole in the injection pump

and I had to PULL MY PANTS DOWN AND SIT ON THE INTAKE MANIFOLD to starve the engine of air.

I removed the pump and tried to run the engine by pouring diesel down the manifold. Engine started and idled fine for 15 seconds before my wife stopped pouring diesel.

So I have now ordered an injection pump and linkages from a guy on eBay (parted out from a wrecked car)

Im covered in diesel, motor oil and have a large cut on my hand from a piece of shrapnel, A LARGE RED WELT ON MY ASSCHEEK FROM THE SUCTION and so is the car completely coated in fluids... and some got on my Jetta Sportwagen (where I keep my tools)... (I hope it doesn't stain the paint!)

I got lucky and didn't destroy my engine. Don't **** with injection pumps when you have no idea what you're doing. I've done injectors, engine swaps, transmission work and at least 100 valve adjustments (put close to 150k miles on 240Ds over the years) and am an experienced mechanic but will never **** with an injection pump again... Lesson learned very quickly.

I'll update this thread once the car is alive... but may have some questions when I get the new pump/linkages (I think my linkage was not setup right, and I was missing a few parts....)

Another fun story for the project car archive eh?

The things we do for these cars... it's an addiction and a labor of love... the neighbors will not stop laughing, one brought over a beer to ease my pain

Post a pic of where the Fuel Injection Pump got a hole in it? In 18 years as a Diesel Mechanic that has not happen to me nor anyone else I know of.
It has been know for old pumps that have sat around to have the racks stick in the full fuel position. But, the MW Fuel Injection Pumps have an issue that if you put on a new or remove and reinstall the Vacuum Shutoff and you get it installed wrong you are guaranteed a run away.

It is entirely possible the previous owner bugged up the Fuel Injection pump.

A moot point now but it does sound like the sticking plugging issue was the problem.

I am curious about something the delivery valve parts that you removed were they small parts?

MyOld240D · #19 04-15-2019, 05:36 PM

Ill post some photos when the IP has been removed from the car. It's truly a ****show. I'm not doing any work on the car until I receive the eBay IP and linkage I ordered

barry12345 · #20 04-15-2019, 08:01 PM

Well at least you got it to provide fuel.

Meant to add something besides the pain of the overall event. Where you succeeded only to have it blow up in your face. So to speak.

I have never experienced a runaway or unintentional wide open injection pump and hope to never. It has to be an experience better missed. Probably somewhat terrorizing. Maybe the back bearing seized and the shaft broke and beat a hole in the housing..

vwnate1 · #21 04-15-2019, 09:51 PM

Oh, crap .

Maxbumpo · #22 04-17-2019, 07:17 AM

Well, this is progress! 'Twas a bad pump, engine / car should be fine once you get a good pump on there.

Maxbumpo · #23 04-17-2019, 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diesel911

Yes as my Bosses business struggled we started using Diesel Fuel Instead of Calibration Oil in the Test Stands.

And after several months in the Machine Diesel Fuel smells really rank.

I have taken a part quite a few Fuel Injection Pumps that had droplets of Water inside of them.

People were not running veggie or biodiesel when I worked in the Fuel Injection Shop.

OK thanks, I would not have thought that. Given that injection pumps and injectors can sit on the shelf in storage for a bit, I'm surprised that the working fluid (calibration oil or diesel fuel) would cause this issue. Also this doesn't line up with my experience that older diesel engine Mercedes will start right up once a fresh battery is installed, after sitting for years.

Diesel911 · #24 04-17-2019, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maxbumpo

OK thanks, I would not have thought that. Given that injection pumps and injectors can sit on the shelf in storage for a bit, I'm surprised that the working fluid (calibration oil or diesel fuel) would cause this issue. Also this doesn't line up with my experience that older diesel engine Mercedes will start right up once a fresh battery is installed, after sitting for years.

When a Fuel Injection Pump is on the Vehicle it is a closed system. What I got from the OP is that the Fuel Injection Pump was not on the Engine which means the Pump was no longer with in that sealed system. In fact was the Fuel Injection Pump even from the Engine he has. Who know how long that Fuel Injection Pump could have sat around unused and the Fuel evaporating and getting thicker and thicker with time.

Water is the most common contaminant in Diesel Fuel.

The other issue I have read is there is a certain amount of Water bound with in the diesel fuel (I am not speaking of liquid water which would separate). What happens to that bound Water when the rest of the Fuel starts evaporating? If it returns to a liquid Water state then it can cause rust.
I don't know what other situations would cause Water to come out of suspension in the Diesel Fuel.

Then there is of course liquid Water moving along with the Diesel Fuel which normally gravity pulls to the bottom but if the flow is fast enough it can go along with the Diesel Fuel. (Water Separators usually have an expansion area that slows the flow down so that the Water has time to separate.) Liquid Water can cause rust, sludge and that dreaded growth.

Then there is humidity and condensation. A Fuel Injection Pump sitting open in a box in a Garage especially some place that has cold winter temps or high humidity can over time suffer from condensation inside of the openings of the Fuel Injection Pump.

In any event it does sound like in this case something was not allowing Fuel into the Elements so there was no Fuel going to the Injectors. When that was cleared he got fuel.
It is not clear if what he did to do that caused either the run-away or the breakage.

I have a unfounded suspicion that he removed those 13mm Nuts and removed one or more elements. Nut no evidence of that was posted.

Note that sludgy thick Oil (and also internal rust) can also make the rack stick. That by itself could cause a run-away.