Craigslist alert thread:

[ROLLGUY]

Originally Posted by SonnyMorrow

https://inlandempire.craigslist.org/cto/d/1983-mercedes-240d-4-speed/6562298329.html

Pretty overpriced in my opinion but nevertheless, a beautiful w123 in cypress green.

But just for fun what do you guys think, is this a real Euro import or is it a USA spec 240d with Euro bumpers. I see many indications that lead me to believe its a USA spec 240d. No vacuum headlight adjustment switch, no cloth interior, and of course the two USA bumper holes in the rear quarter panels. What else can you guys detect?

The holes could have been for the mounts for full wrap around bumpers without the rubber boot, although being an '83, I believe all the Euro bumpers had the rubber boots by then. It is possible that the guy (or someone previous) traded interiors. The cloth interior would have been worth a lot more than the MB Tex. The only real way to know is to get the VIN, and see what it was equipped with from the factory.

[SonnyMorrow]

Originally Posted by ROLLGUY

The holes could have been for the mounts for full wrap around bumpers without the rubber boot, although being an '83, I believe all the Euro bumpers had the rubber boots by then. It is possible that the guy (or someone previous) traded interiors. The cloth interior would have been worth a lot more than the MB Tex. The only real way to know is to get the VIN, and see what it was equipped with from the factory.

That could be true, but three piece Euro bumpers never came on any diesel W123. Yea for sure, the only real way is to see the vin. But it is quite fun to use clues and some detective work.

Anyhow it is pretty common to find Euro spec W123s with USA lights as they usually get federalized during import (no red flags there) However, I just noticed the tail lights are USA as well which don't usually get swapped out during federalization. Does anyone see anything else?

[vwnate1]

Typical clueless 'enthusiast' who puts more into it than it'll ever be worth then LIES when he gives up and sells it .

I see he's too lazy to clean the engine yet wants top retail dollar for a car with broken AC .

I too love the color and think this might well be a keeper .

[sixto]

Originally Posted by SonnyMorrow

Does anyone see anything else?

Cruise control stalk has English markings. Cruise control isn’t a common option on Euro cars with few other comfort options. On the other hand, was thistle geeen a US color option?

Euro Diesels don’t usually have the Diesel badge. They know what D stands for.

Euro 123s usually have the radio antenna in the front fender.

Does the Euro front tiedown stick out so far?

Sixto
98 E320s sedan and wagon

[SonnyMorrow]

Originally Posted by sixto

Cruise control stalk has English markings. Cruise control isn’t a common option on Euro cars with few other comfort options. On the other hand, was thistle geeen a US color option?

Euro Diesels don’t usually have the Diesel badge. They know what D stands for.

Euro 123s usually have the radio antenna in the front fender.

Does the Euro front tiedown stick out so far?

Sixto
98 E320s sedan and wagon

Oh wow good eye, I didn't see the cruise control stalk. Now that I think about it, I don't think I have ever seen a Euro W123 with cruise control. I didn't see the diesel badge either, that is a dead giveaway of it being US spec. I wouldn't buy this car just based on the fact that the owner is lying so hard about its "German history."

I've owned three true Euro spec W123s, and only one of them had a front fender mounted antenna. Though I am still not quite sure what dictates where the antenna is installed from the factory. So I guess we can disregard the antenna placement.

A friend of mine just gave me his beater '83 300d US spec W123, and it is Thistle Green (881) Though it is an uncommon color in the USA.

The tiedown looks that of a Euro spec W123, but what else can we detect? Anyone? (just for fun)

[FrankM]

I wonder what the dash looks like under the skin....

[240Dee]

Originally Posted by sixto

Cruise control stalk has English markings. Cruise control isn’t a common option on Euro cars with few other comfort options. On the other hand, was thistle geeen a US color option?

Euro Diesels don’t usually have the Diesel badge. They know what D stands for.

Euro 123s usually have the radio antenna in the front fender.

Does the Euro front tiedown stick out so far?

Sixto
98 E320s sedan and wagon

Sixto - don’t forget the flashy 300D tail light trim! 240D came stock with plain black trim under the lights. This guy upgraded, and I like it! I know I’m also saying this to the wrong crowd, but $7K for a well sorted (which has yet be confirmed here) 240D with manual transmission isn’t something I’d consider too rich. I’ve had a lot of people ask me about my car and if I’d sell it - answer is always yes followed by “for a lot more than you’d ever be willing to pay.” And then folks trying to hone in on $5K, but two (younger budding collectors) came up meaningfully north of that. Still didn’t sell :-).





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[vwnate1]

Agreed 240dee ;

Notice I didn't say it's not a nice car as it is, I was just pointing out the market won't bear it .

This car is decidedly _not_ 'well sorted'.

It's also clearly a U.S. model, he doesn't claim it to be anything else .

[240Dee]

Originally Posted by vwnate1

Agreed 240dee ;



Notice I didn't say it's not a nice car as it is, I was just pointing out the market won't bear it .



This car is decidedly _not_ 'well sorted'.



It's also clearly a U.S. model, he doesn't claim it to be anything else .

Yeah agreed, and it would be really cool to know what it eventually sells for....I also reward negative points for the failed AC conversion :-)


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[HarvAMG]

Amazing how someone can polish the outside of the car but totally neglect the interior and engine bay like it somehow doesn't count. Those carpets are filthy dirty.

[vwnate1]

Oh no my Son ~

You have to be searching the self - service junk yards to fully understand how nasty (! bio-hazard !) nice unworn original carpets can be, you'll cheerfully pay $10 each and then spend hours washing and vacuuming them out before it really sinks in .

The nice part is when strangers look and say "wow ! even the carpets look new !" when looking at your 427,000 + mile hoopty W123 .

The good thing is : wet/dry tank vacuums are cheap these days and really work well .

[steamboatsykes]

Originally Posted by SonnyMorrow

The tiedown looks that of a Euro spec W123, but what else can we detect? Anyone? (just for fun)

The wood trim on the console and dash, typically black plastic on a 240 euro.

[SonnyMorrow]

Originally Posted by steamboatsykes

The wood trim on the console and dash, typically black plastic on a 240 euro.

Yes, I can totally agree with that one. Hmm I wonder if there are any more nuances we can spot.

I don't think it is a big deal if you mistakenly list your car for sale as a Euro spec, but to blatantly lie about it and come up with a convoluted backstory is just plain deceptive. I think it is safe to say that the odometer could have been rolled back too, especially if the owner is a liar right off the bat. And on top of that all, the price obviously reflects the fact that it is "rare" and has "German history." Perhaps the previous owner constructed the lie, so I can't hate on the current seller.

[ROLLGUY]

Originally Posted by SonnyMorrow

Yes, I can totally agree with that one. Hmm I wonder if there are any more nuances we can spot.

I don't think it is a big deal if you mistakenly list your car for sale as a Euro spec, but to blatantly lie about it and come up with a convoluted backstory is just plain deceptive. I think it is safe to say that the odometer could have been rolled back too, especially if the owner is a liar right off the bat. And on top of that all, the price obviously reflects the fact that it is "rare" and has "German history." Perhaps the previous owner constructed the lie, so I can't hate on the current seller.

The odometer could have not been working (as is the case with most) for many miles, so it doesn't necessarily need to have been "rolled back". And yes, there are so many things that point to the fact that this car WAS/IS NOT a Euro delivered car.

[240Dee]

Originally Posted by SonnyMorrow

Yes, I can totally agree with that one. Hmm I wonder if there are any more nuances we can spot.



I don't think it is a big deal if you mistakenly list your car for sale as a Euro spec, but to blatantly lie about it and come up with a convoluted backstory is just plain deceptive. I think it is safe to say that the odometer could have been rolled back too, especially if the owner is a liar right off the bat. And on top of that all, the price obviously reflects the fact that it is "rare" and has "German history." Perhaps the previous owner constructed the lie, so I can't hate on the current seller.

That’s really interesting - mine has all black plastic there and I was wondering why/how that came to be - I’ve never seen a largely black plastic interior on a W123 before, always that zebrano everywhere! How can you tell if your car was in fact part of a euro delivery option? Or a build to spec (because mine is definitely a custom order) in Germany and then federalize en route to USA?


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